Was Jesus God?

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August 8th, 2016 at 11:50:02 AM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
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Wow, please read the Bible. Jesus is constantly forbidding those for whom He preforms a miracle or healing from telling people who He is. He is always silencing the demons who definitely know who He is from telling anyone as they are driven away. The last thing Jesus wants to be know as is some kind of magician or miracle man. Also you are very wrong about what you think is common in the 1st century. Can you name any other person in that time period that was claimed to be of virgin birth?
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August 8th, 2016 at 11:58:11 AM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
Wow, please read the Bible. Jesus is constantly forbidding those for whom He preforms a miracle or healing from telling people who He is.


Even more damning, then. He would have
told them his mom was a virgin and it would
just be another secret revealed after his death.

Of course there were no 'miracles', it was all
made up decades after he died. Him keeping
things secret is just a plot devise invented to
add drama to the story. Obviously.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
August 8th, 2016 at 12:09:32 PM permalink
Nareed
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 346
Posts: 12545
Quote: FrGamble
Can you name any other person in that time period that was claimed to be of virgin birth?


Hatshepsut, for one. Her story claims her father, the one true god Amun, came to her mother Ahmose, under the guise of her husband, Thutmose I, and touched an Ankh to her nose, which resulted in Hatshepsut's eventual birth. Hatshepsut was Ahmose's first born child, so do the math.

Keeping things in the dynasty, Amun does the same to bring forth Amenhotep III.

Oh, there's the one true god Athena who sprang forth from the head of the one true god Zeus (and she came fully grown and armed!). And the one true god Aphrodite arose from the sea after the testes of the one true god Ouranos were cut off and cast into the sea by the one true god Chronos.

See? It's a common mythological device.
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August 8th, 2016 at 1:22:22 PM permalink
Nareed
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 346
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Lest we forget, there's also a Macedonian king known as Alexander the Great.

His mother, Olympias, claimed that on the eve of the consummation of her marriage to Philip, she dreamed that her womb was struck by a thunder bolt, causing a flame that spread "far and wide" before dying away.

Later on when alexander conquered (or liberated) Egypt, he journeyed to the oasis at Siwa (located in modern Libya), where the oracle pronounced him to be the son of Amun. This is clear-cut confirmation that Alexander of Macedon was the son of Zeus, born to the virgin queen Olympias. How else can one explain his miraculous string of complete and utter victories over every foe?

Who's to say Zeus-Amun did not conceive Alexander both to spread Greek civilization widely, even unto Persia and India, and to shelter the nascent city of Rome from powerful enemies which might have conquered it? With the large, unified Persian empire gone, and the major powers now squabbling and fighting each other for control of Alexander's conquests, Rome was safe for centuries. This explains why Alexander sacrificed himself in his prime.
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August 8th, 2016 at 2:01:21 PM permalink
Dalex64
Member since: Mar 8, 2014
Threads: 3
Posts: 3687
Quote: FrGamble
Wow, please read the Bible. Jesus is constantly forbidding those for whom He preforms a miracle or healing from telling people who He is. He is always silencing the demons who definitely know who He is from telling anyone as they are driven away. The last thing Jesus wants to be know as is some kind of magician or miracle man. Also you are very wrong about what you think is common in the 1st century. Can you name any other person in that time period that was claimed to be of virgin birth?


They all asked, "Are you then the Son of God?" He replied, "You say that I am."

Luke 22:70 English Standard Version

And they all said, "Are You the Son of God, then?" And He said to them, "Yes, I am."

Luke 22:70 New American Standard Bible
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan
August 8th, 2016 at 3:13:36 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Nareed
Hatshepsut, for one. Her story claims her father, the one true god Amun, came to her mother Ahmose, under the guise of her husband, Thutmose I, and touched an Ankh to her nose, which resulted in Hatshepsut's eventual birth. Hatshepsut was Ahmose's first born child, so do the math.

Keeping things in the dynasty, Amun does the same to bring forth Amenhotep III.

Oh, there's the one true god Athena who sprang forth from the head of the one true god Zeus (and she came fully grown and armed!). And the one true god Aphrodite arose from the sea after the testes of the one true god Ouranos were cut off and cast into the sea by the one true god Chronos.

See? It's a common mythological device.


See now these are some myths! They are very different than a poor young girl from a backwater town being visited by an angel who humbly invites her, who is full of grace to participate in God's plan by miraculously conceiving and giving birth to a son who is true God and true man. In fact I struggle to find hardly any similarities between them at all.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
August 8th, 2016 at 3:19:37 PM permalink
Nareed
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 346
Posts: 12545
Quote: FrGamble
See now these are some myths!


As are yours.

I keep saying there's nothing remarkable about a group of Hebrews setting up a myth, right when Rome institutionalized the practice. And I see nothing intrinsically more valuable about Hebrew mythology than any other.
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August 8th, 2016 at 3:27:37 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Nareed
As are yours.

I keep saying there's nothing remarkable about a group of Hebrews setting up a myth, right when Rome institutionalized the practice. And I see nothing intrinsically more valuable about Hebrew mythology than any other.


It is fairly obvious that Hebrew myths are not as fantastical and phony. Maybe that is because they are real.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
August 8th, 2016 at 3:29:39 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
It is fairly obvious that Hebrew myths are not as fantastical and phony. Maybe that is because they are real.


Maybe they're all real and should be called
facts and not myths. Maybe every story
ever made up is real. Is that the world you
live in? If your myth is real, they all are.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
August 8th, 2016 at 3:34:18 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Evenbob
Maybe they're all real and should be called
facts and not myths. Maybe every story
ever made up is real. Is that the world you
live in? If your myth is real, they all are.


Wow, again no reason to go all crazy on us here. I think you can use your common sense to determine what is fact and what is myth. There is a genre of myths that Joe Campell talks a lot about. You can easily recognize that cut off testicles thrown into the sea giving birth to someone is a myth. An unknown teenage girl who has a quiet visit by an angel and lives in obscurity most of her life is not written as a myth but history, the history of salvation.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
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