Happy Easter!

Quote: FrGamble

I hope you see that your sources wherever they may come from cannot know what the Church teaches better than the Church herself.

They certainly can't spin it like the Church
does, if that's what you mean. It doesn't
matter what the Church says, it's not the
12th century anymore. The info is out
there, people know what's going on,
that's why there is such a drastic
shortage of priests and nuns making
a commitment to join a sinking ship.

The cat is out of the bag. The Church
as moral arbiter is something nobody
takes seriously anymore. Even the
confessional is on the way out. The
Boston Globe says only 2% of Catholics
go on a regular basis, and 75% never
go at all. Compare that to the 60's
when most went on a regular basis.

I'm sure FrG will say I'm 100% wrong
as usual, and dismiss the Globe as being
all lies.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2014/02/16/catholic-confession-steep-price/NbMVFfYljv26Gcphu17yPJ/story.html

It's a fascinating article. How the priests again
and again ruined confession by constantly
using it as a means to violate women. Of
course it really hit the fan when in 1910 the
pope wisely let children come to confession,
and made the whole 20th century 100 years
of child abuse in the Church. The priests got out
of it by going to confession! There's that
circular reasoning again, bless it's heart..
What a racket.

Very interesting article and it shows a little bit of what I'm talking about. In regards to the statistics about attendance at confessions there is no doubt that not a lot of Catholics are going to the Sacrament of Reconciliation. If you talk about the entire Catholic population, including those who don't go to Church then the 2% might be right, I'm not sure. I do know that the percentage is greater when you are talking about active parishioners.

Then you go off the rails again and use an interview with a man who had an awful experience happen to him in confession as the Gospel truth. You claim the whole 20th century as 100 years of child abuse in the Church. How can you make such ridiculous statements that are obviously warped? I will tread lightly because as the interview makes clear those who have had bad experiences can understandably allow it to color their views, maybe this is the case with yourself I don't know. However you can read the John Jay report yourself here and you can find that the clergy sexual abuse scandal was not 100 years of abuse and what the more accurate percentage of abuser priest really are and that it is lower than the general male population. Here is a quote from the USA Today by Dr. Philip Jenkins, Pennsylvania State University,"If anyone believes that priests offend at a higher rate than teachers or non-celibate clergy, then they should produce the evidence on which they are basing that conclusion. I know of none. Saying 'everybody knows' does not constitute scientific methodology."

Quote: FrGamble

Saying 'everybody knows' does not constitute scientific methodology."

"Gay and straight priests alike are cheering Pope Francis's comments about homosexuality in the priesthood, saying gay priests make up a significant segment of the Catholic clergy and deserve papal recognition."

US News http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/07/29/catholic-priests-its-empirical-fact-that-many-clergy-are-gay

I have nothing against Gay people at
all. But don't you find it odd that the
even the low estimates of Gay priests
puts the number at over 60%? Why is
that your god 'calls' so many Gay men
to the priesthood, and yet is fervently against
what Gay men stand for. I really want to know
the answer, because it makes no sense.

I do know that a few of the older Gay men
I knew 30 years ago said every place you see
men only groups (military officers, men only
fraternal clubs, YMCA, the priesthood) you
find a huge number of Gays compared to
groups that have both men and women.

Under 3% of the population is Gay, yet 60+%
of Catholic clergy is Gay. Doesn't this seem
odd to you?

Quote: Evenbob

"Gay and straight priests alike are cheering Pope Francis's comments about homosexuality in the priesthood, saying gay priests make up a significant segment of the Catholic clergy and deserve papal recognition."

US News http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/07/29/catholic-priests-its-empirical-fact-that-many-clergy-are-gay

I have nothing against Gay people at
all. But don't you find it odd that the
even the low estimates of Gay priests
puts the number at over 60%? Why is
that your god 'calls' so many Gay men
to the priesthood, and yet is fervently against
what Gay men stand for. I really want to know
the answer, because it makes no sense.

I do know that a few of the older Gay men
I knew 30 years ago said every place you see
men only groups (military officers, men only
fraternal clubs, YMCA, the priesthood) you
find a huge number of Gays compared to
groups that have both men and women.

Under 3% of the population is Gay, yet 60+%
of Catholic clergy is Gay. Doesn't this seem
odd to you?

Bob can't even read articles very well anymore, poor old man:

"The notion that many Catholic priests are quietly gay is not new. In the 2000 book "The Changing Face of the Priesthood," Rev. Donald B. Cozzens suggested that the priesthood was increasingly becoming a gay profession. Cozzens estimated that as much as 58 percent of priests were gay, and that percentages were even higher for younger priests. His numbers matched previous estimates by sociologists who put the numbers of gay priests between 10 and 60 percent."

There's a low estimate there at 58%. And another at 10%. Neither are over 60%.

Quote: TheCesspit

There's a low estimate there at 58%. And another at 10%. Neither are over 60%.

Poor old CessPool, doesn't know how to
do further research.

'One seminary rector based on his own experience told me the number was at least 50%.'

'HE ACTUALLY CAME BACK FROM ROME WITH HIS FAITH IN TATTERS HAVING BEING SEDUCED AND TAKEN TO BED BY A LOT OF CLERGY IN ROME - SOME AT A HIGH LEVEL IN THE CHURCH. HE HAS NOW LEFT THE PRIESTHOOD... IS HIS CLAIM TRUE THAT MOST MODERN CATHOLIC PRIESTS ARE GAY' http://wisecatholic.blogspot.com/2013/08/is-catholic-priesthood-predominantly.html

'Between 20 and 60 percent of all Catholic priests are gay' http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2013/12/gay-clergy-catholic-church-vatican

'During 1990, Rev. Thomas Crangle, a Franciscan priest in Passaic, N.J., mailed a survey to 500 randomly selected priests. Of the 398 responses, about 45% said that they were gay'

That was 25 years ago. The number of Gay priests
has gone up and up since then. But now, because
of all the scandals, they are having a hard time
getting anybody into the clergy, Gay or straight.
It's fascinating that Gays are less then 3% of the
population, yet run the fashion and art world, much
of Hollywood. and the most powerful Church in
the world. Yet they are reviled in most places in
the world.

I never met a Gay person I didn't like, they are almost
always intelligent. I wonder when they will get their
due..

There are facts, and there are conclusions drawn from facts.

It is usually fairly easy to verify or debunk the facts.

Some of the conclusions I have seen recently are pretty wild.

Quote: Evenbob

Poor old CessPool, doesn't know how to
do further research.

'One seminary rector based on his own experience told me the number was at least 50%.'

'HE ACTUALLY CAME BACK FROM ROME WITH HIS FAITH IN TATTERS HAVING BEING SEDUCED AND TAKEN TO BED BY A LOT OF CLERGY IN ROME - SOME AT A HIGH LEVEL IN THE CHURCH. HE HAS NOW LEFT THE PRIESTHOOD... IS HIS CLAIM TRUE THAT MOST MODERN CATHOLIC PRIESTS ARE GAY' http://wisecatholic.blogspot.com/2013/08/is-catholic-priesthood-predominantly.html

'Between 20 and 60 percent of all Catholic priests are gay' http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2013/12/gay-clergy-catholic-church-vatican

'During 1990, Rev. Thomas Crangle, a Franciscan priest in Passaic, N.J., mailed a survey to 500 randomly selected priests. Of the 398 responses, about 45% said that they were gay'

Impressive list of resources,.... except none of them back up this little tidbit:

Quote:

"But don't you find it odd that the
even the low estimates of Gay priests
puts the number at over 60%?"

Not a single one. The HIGHEST estimate is 60%. Not the lowest.

So yeah, thanks for pointing out your inability to cite facts in documents you read. You just extrapolate and decide it must be over 60%.

Not how it works.

Quote: TheCesspit

Not how it works.

Why are you such a homophobe.

This is becoming a wide ranging discussion Bob. Every time you are challenged or proved wrong are you just going to bring up something else? To me this is kind of a non-issue. I can say as a priest that my experience is that the percentage of my brothers who are gay is nowhere in the ballpark of 60%, but I would say that it is higher than the generally accepted percentage of the American population of around 3.8%. The next question is who cares? Celibacy is the same for homosexuals as it is for heterosexuals in the priesthood. I remember in seminary one of the seminarians came out as gay and the Bishop basically said, "Who cares? Are you living chastely and can you do so? Do you feel like you are called to the priesthood?"

Quote: Evenbob

Why are you such a homophobe.

That's the best you got to come back with? Someone points out your making it up as you go along, points out how your very articles you use to prove your point don't say what you claim they say, and you decide to go for the ad hominem attack, eh?

Sad, so sad.