Yet another aviation thread.

The Mitsubishi Regional Jet, very originally named Mitsubishi regional Jet, arrived in Paris' Le Bourget airport for the anual Paris Air Show. It's painted in ANA (All Nippon Airways) livery, as that is the nominal launch customer.

In unrelated news, the Boeing 747-8 is still dead. It's expected to be join shortly by the A-380.

On more serious news, jet fuel is so cheap these days compared to the recent past, that airlines are hanging on to older, less fuel-efficient airplanes. This is going on to the point that orders placed for newer airplanes, particularly wide bodies, are being deferred, and new orders are being delayed or cancelled altogether.

What this means is that any airline charging a fuel "surcharge" is really morally guilty of price-gouging.

Quote: Nareed

What this means is that any airline charging a fuel "surcharge" is really morally guilty of price-gouging.

Perhaps the airlines will re-name it 'resort fee'.

For a long time delivery promises have been part contractual and part marketing strategy.

New narrowbodies dominate at Paris this year, as Airbus and Boeing face continue weakness in demand for their “Show”ier widebody jets. Aviation Week.

New from the Paris Air Show.

Airbus plans to offer an A-380 plus. It won't have new engines, but through improved architecture, including changes to the wing and winglets, it will have improved fuel efficiency. Redesign of stairs and other interior components will allow more passengers to be packed in, too.

So far so normal. But then there is a proposal for 11-abreast seating in economy, 3-5-3.

Aren't things bad enough in the back already? granted, airbus claims this would still keep seat width at 18" (really??), but it would involve pushing window-seat passengers against the curved interior fitting.

We'll see. I don't think this will drum up new business, nor make Emirates want to order a few hundred more.

Quote: Nareed

We'll see. I don't think this will drum up new business, nor make Emirates want to order a few hundred more.

Since April of 2015 Airbus has delivered 4 to Asiana Airways, and 2 to British Airways. The rest of the production line has gone to the Middle East. I agree that orders for a few hundred are not likely, but you can't rule out an order for a few dozen more.

Quote: Pacomartin

Since April of 2015 Airbus has delivered 4 to Asiana Airways, and 2 to British Airways. The rest of the production line has gone to the Middle East. I agree that orders for a few hundred are not likely, but you can't rule out an order for a few dozen more.

Do you think it's likely some outstanding orders might be converted to the new variant?

I doubt Virgin Atlantic will actually take any of the orders it placed. maybe Qantas will want one or two more (doubtful). But Emirates, I believe, has many to be delivered yet.

Quote: Nareed

but it would involve pushing window-seat passengers against the curved interior fitting.

There seems to be three segments to the market: Sardines, Business Class and Luxury Class. And two main types of hardware.......... narrow body and wide body behemoths.

Quote: Nareed

Do you think it's likely some outstanding orders might be converted to the new variant?

I think four airlines have orders that probably won't be cancelled, and the other five airlines are sort of on the books although it is questionable if they will ever be delivered. It is possible all Airbus will accomplish with the new design is to actually deliver some of the questionable orders.


Probably won't be cancelled (57 orders)
47 Emirates
5 Singapore Airlines
3 All Nippon Airways
2 Qatar Airways

Questionable (47 orders)
20 Amedeo
10 Unidentified (Hong Kong!)
8 Qantas
6 Virgin Atlantic
3 Air Accord

Quote: Pacomartin

I think four airlines have orders that probably won't be cancelled,

I do wonder.

Quote:

and the other five airlines are sort of on the books although it is questionable if they will ever be delivered. It is possible all Airbus will accomplish with the new design is to actually deliver some of the questionable orders.

Buzz on the aviation press is that it's too little.

If half the promises made in Europe and America about advanced ATC can ever be implemented, frequencies will continue to rule for decades to come. This reduces the need for a very large plane. Ironically, though, small planes are getting larger ;)

Boeing has dropped the 747 / very large planes from its 20 year market forecast.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-20/boeing-s-vision-for-the-future-has-no-place-for-the-iconic-747

The passenger 747-8I has not sold well at all. They are talking about officially ending it. There are still some freighters selling.