Terrible, horrible attack in Paris

November 20th, 2015 at 2:45:23 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
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November 22nd, 2015 at 8:26:25 AM permalink
odiousgambit
Member since: Oct 28, 2012
Threads: 72
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Quote: terapined
It impossible to determine who the wrong kind of people are simply by appearance, race, national origin, color of hair, accent, religion ect


It's the trap of Generalization. I've commented before, if you try to make a Generalization a Universal , then you face a fallacy, it's all undone by even a single exception.

People are entitled to be judged on their own merits when it comes to most situations. If it is true that a certain ethnicity has little education generally speaking, still when one of their members applies for a job, that person is entitled to be judged on what education he has accomplished, and it is a shame if prejudice prevents it.

There are just other situations where the other side of the matter is entitled to its best interest. The treatment of people who are not Citizens certainly looms large for me as one of those other situations.
Mustard:You like Kipling, Miss Scarlet? Sure, I'll eat anything [from movie]
November 22nd, 2015 at 9:58:53 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
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Quote: odiousgambit

People are entitled to be judged on their own merits when it comes to most situations. If it is true that a certain ethnicity has little education generally speaking, still when one of their members applies for a job, that person is entitled to be judged on what education he has accomplished, and it is a shame if prejudice prevents it.

There are just other situations where the other side of the matter is entitled to its best interest. The treatment of people who are not Citizens certainly looms large for me as one of those other situations.


This is all many of us are trying to say. Watching for your own security trumps "being nice."
The man who damns money has obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it has earned it
November 22nd, 2015 at 5:15:00 PM permalink
odiousgambit
Member since: Oct 28, 2012
Threads: 72
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Quote: AZDuffman
Watching for your own security trumps "being nice."


a statement that distills this whole side of the argument.
Mustard:You like Kipling, Miss Scarlet? Sure, I'll eat anything [from movie]
November 22nd, 2015 at 5:31:58 PM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
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I guess as long as you and your family never expect to be a position where you are caged or rejected back into a place of violence, solutions come easy to you.
No one has ever proven I am not God.
November 22nd, 2015 at 5:42:25 PM permalink
boymimbo
Member since: Mar 25, 2013
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You can do both. The US is not going to pull from the refugee swath entering Greece via boats. Like Canada, they will likely pull from the existing refugee camps and will vet and use the Patriot Act to track the riskier of these folks.

You might be surprised to know that the US has admitted 33,338 Muslim Somalian and 25,655 Shia Iraqi refugees in the last 6 years ending December 31, 2014, with no attacks from that community. (source: wrapsnet.org). Somalia is home of course to Al-Shabab while Iraq is home to ISIS.

It's called being compassionate with the public overreacting to a terrible attack perpetrated by 8 individuals. Canada is set to take in 25,000 refugees from Syria this year and while there is a bit of backlash here from it, much of the backlash isn't due to safety concerns but from the inability to find the infrastructure and proper support for these people. In our terrorist plots and attacks (and there are been a few planned and one successful) all have come from people who were living in Canada and were turned into extremists from within.

This is why Obama is not pulling the plug.
November 22nd, 2015 at 6:32:58 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
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Quote: rxwine
I guess as long as you and your family never expect to be a position where you are caged or rejected back into a place of violence, solutions come easy to you.


Again, you do not take refugees from a country that is hostile to you and part of a culture that does not match your own. We can't save the world. This is a flood of angry young males we are taking. We will have to learn the hard way. Why are they not instead going to other Arab countries?

While it is unscientific I can say that the left is really on the wrong side of this. At work I am in a room with several black females, IOW core Democrat voters. None are in favor of this and several are openly hostile. Seems to me the people most in favor are the limousine liberal types who never have to live among the mess their policies create and instead remain isolated in nice, suburban neighborhoods. This has the potential to send them down like 1972.
The man who damns money has obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it has earned it
November 22nd, 2015 at 6:35:16 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
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Quote: boymimbo
You can do both. The US is not going to pull from the refugee swath entering Greece via boats. Like Canada, they will likely pull from the existing refugee camps and will vet and use the Patriot Act to track the riskier of these folks.


This always cracks me up. How on earth are they going to vet people with no background to check? The feds can't keep track of all the illegal aliens we have here now, how will they do any better here?


Quote:
You might be surprised to know that the US has admitted 33,338 Muslim Somalian and 25,655 Shia Iraqi refugees in the last 6 years ending December 31, 2014, with no attacks from that community. (source: wrapsnet.org). Somalia is home of course to Al-Shabab while Iraq is home to ISIS.


It does not have to be a major "attack" to be a problem. We are hearing that the no-go ghettos of muslims in Europe really exist after all! They exist here in the USA as well. I was asked and proved how dangerous Dearborn is. Do you really want more of this?
The man who damns money has obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it has earned it
November 22nd, 2015 at 7:22:11 PM permalink
boymimbo
Member since: Mar 25, 2013
Threads: 5
Posts: 615
I don't think I have a problem housing Iraqi refugees in Dearborn MI that the US bombed the crap out of it. We can start talking about the hundreds of thousands of innocent Iraqis killed via "collateral damage". Dearborn is fine. Big cities have neighborhoods that are predominately one nationality.

That US has let in 59,000 Muslim refugees from these two countries alone over the last six years and there have been no attacks. Apparently either America has just gotten lucky or the US government is actually vetting these individuals.
November 23rd, 2015 at 3:00:40 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 99
Posts: 6317
Quote: boymimbo

That US has let in 59,000 Muslim refugees from these two countries alone over the last six years and there have been no attacks. Apparently either America has just gotten lucky or the US government is actually vetting these individuals.


There has been much crime as has been pointed out, so actually we are probably not. Muslim ghettos are not at all friendly places so probably not as well. Your standard of "but there have been no attacks" would be like a restaurant serving bad food and many people got sick but the owner tells the health department, "hey, the place is fine, nobody has died yet!"

It is very easy to say how great it all is when watching from a nice suburban neighborhood where you do not deal with it.
The man who damns money has obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it has earned it