Neo-monophysitism

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December 10th, 2015 at 3:13:03 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Nareed

You may be shocked to hear Genesis was around, read and believed long, long, long before the church fathers' time.

Do you know the line about pride and falls?

I'll settle for one month's worth of Texas' GDP.


Excellent point and you are correct. Do you want to find some of the ancient Rabbis and scholars of the law who knew Genesis was not a literal account or should I. You were wise to lower the sum.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
December 10th, 2015 at 3:30:00 PM permalink
Nareed
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 346
Posts: 12545
Quote: FrGamble
Excellent point and you are correct.


I'm always right (except when I'm not), and I'm not afraid to fall.

Quote:
Do you want to find some of the ancient Rabbis and scholars of the law who knew Genesis was not a literal account or should I.


It doesn't matter. The idea of atoms goes back to pre-pre-Socratic philosophers, and survives several iterations. But to the average Julius through Greek, Roman, Medieval and Renaissance times, matter was made up of four elements in varying amounts and ratios. So maybe whoever wrote Genesis added a disclaimer saying "this is not a literal account of creation." So what? Uncounted hundreds of thousands, at least, knew the story was the literal truth.

Quote:
You were wise to lower the sum.


Why? Did you find Texas' GDP in last weeks tithes?

Oh, the literal belief in Genesis is not an exclusively protestant attitude. I recall a devout Catholic classmate in high school biology strenuously objected to being taught about stellar evolution, never mind biological evolution, taking place "before God created the world in 4,004 BCE."

The teacher's response was priceless: "I respect your beliefs, but not when it comes to the test." (we had 3 monthly tests and a final for the semester.)
Donald Trump is a one-term LOSER
December 11th, 2015 at 12:50:54 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Nareed

It doesn't matter. The idea of atoms goes back to pre-pre-Socratic philosophers, and survives several iterations. But to the average Julius through Greek, Roman, Medieval and Renaissance times, matter was made up of four elements in varying amounts and ratios. So maybe whoever wrote Genesis added a disclaimer saying "this is not a literal account of creation." So what?


So it seems like not only has the wager been decreased but also the terms. I am sure we can find some people who do believe in the literal meaning of an obviously not historical account. I will bet the wealth of the United States that we can find some people who believe Dan Brown's novels to be true history as well.



Quote:
Oh, the literal belief in Genesis is not an exclusively protestant attitude. I recall a devout Catholic classmate in high school biology strenuously objected to being taught about stellar evolution, never mind biological evolution, taking place "before God created the world in 4,004 BCE."

The teacher's response was priceless: "I respect your beliefs, but not when it comes to the test." (we had 3 monthly tests and a final for the semester.)


Oh, your Catholic high school classmate believed that, I stand corrected. By the way I like your teacher's response too except that the teacher probably should have just told the student he/she was wrong and shown the student why.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
December 11th, 2015 at 3:14:26 PM permalink
Nareed
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 346
Posts: 12545
Quote: FrGamble
So it seems like not only has the wager been decreased but also the terms. I am sure we can find some people who do believe in the literal meaning of an obviously not historical account. I will bet the wealth of the United States that we can find some people who believe Dan Brown's novels to be true history as well.


You don't get it.

However a myth starts, it becomes literal truth a short time later and everyone unquestionably believes it. There may be skeptics. They may prove in a number of ways the myth or fable is not literal truth. They may even be right. but millions still believe Jehovah literally created the world in 6 days of 24 hours each, or that the one true God Knum molds every human being out of clay.


Quote:
Oh, your Catholic high school classmate believed that, I stand corrected.


I hear many Catholics claim creationism is a purely Protestant failing, even though their own position is not that far from it. This classmate was one illustration. I know many others who believe it literally. I also know people who believe the Earth is flat, as stated in the Bible.

Quote:
By the way I like your teacher's response too except that the teacher probably should have just told the student he/she was wrong and shown the student why.


That's what the class was for.
Donald Trump is a one-term LOSER
December 11th, 2015 at 3:32:56 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Nareed

However a myth starts, it becomes literal truth a short time later and everyone unquestionably believes it. There may be skeptics. They may prove in a number of ways the myth or fable is not literal truth. They may even be right. but millions still believe Jehovah literally created the world in 6 days of 24 hours each, or that the one true God Knum molds every human being out of clay.


I think we can use your example to answer your own question. Myths that are not true like the one true God Knum, who I imagine no body else on this forum has ever heard of, quickly fades into nothingness and pure myth. Those mythical writings that carry with them truths hidden in their literary genre continue to be valuable and believed not to be literal but of immense importance. Yes, some will believe these myths to be literal because their truths so important and because they fear to let go of the literal interpretation is to do harm to the truths themselves.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
December 11th, 2015 at 3:59:27 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
Yes, some will believe these myths to be literal because their truths so important and because they fear to let go of the literal interpretation is to do harm to the truths themselves.


Are you describing your religion? Except it
contains not a single important truth that's
original to it.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
December 11th, 2015 at 4:07:08 PM permalink
Nareed
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 346
Posts: 12545
Quote: FrGamble
Myths that are not true like the one true God Knum, who I imagine no body else on this forum has ever heard of,


I'd have expected you to show some interest in the roots of your religion. Clearly I was wrong.

Quote:
quickly fades into nothingness and pure myth.


People believed in the one true god Thoth for over 3,000 years. The myth of the man/god/something Jesus is only 2/3s as old.
Donald Trump is a one-term LOSER
December 11th, 2015 at 6:00:29 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: Nareed
The myth of the man/god/something Jesus is only 2/3s as old.


Way older than that. The exact myth of
Jesus appeared appeared several times
prior to the current myth.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
December 11th, 2015 at 6:31:20 PM permalink
Dalex64
Member since: Mar 8, 2014
Threads: 3
Posts: 3687
If the creation stories in Genesis are not true, why should anyone believe that Adam and Eve were real people, as FrGamble has claimed, and that the stories about them in Genesis are true?
The stories all run right into one another. Eve formed from Adam's rib, a talking snake, the tree of knowledge, the betrayal. Why should anyone believe that any of it at all is the literal truth?

If we are supposed to learn a lesson and get a message from it, what are we to make of the matter-of-fact presentation of polygamy by one of their descendants?
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan
December 12th, 2015 at 2:24:31 AM permalink
boymimbo
Member since: Mar 25, 2013
Threads: 5
Posts: 732
Quote: Dalex64
If we are supposed to learn a lesson and get a message from it, what are we to make of the matter-of-fact presentation of polygamy by one of their descendants?


There are stories throughout the OT of deception, polygamy, and prostitution, some of whom are part of the bloodline through to Jesus. Just look at the 12 tribes of Israel which are through Jacob, two wives, and two wive's servants.
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