Simple question?
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May 15th, 2017 at 11:43:39 AM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
I wondered about this back when I was trying out Xtionity 45 years ago. If heaven is so great, if being in gods presence is so stunning, why would you ever give that up. You wouldn't. The myth had to have an antagonist, even if his back story is ridiculous. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
May 15th, 2017 at 11:58:22 AM permalink | |
Nareed Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 346 Posts: 12545 |
Want to hear something funny? If you read what Plato wrote about Atlantis, you wouldn't be impressed at all. He make sit sound as an awesome bronze age civilization, centered around a large and quite impressive city. Impressive for the time, sure. Impressive now, not so much. Not past a generic "Look at what they built without even iron tools" kind of way. And, really, there's a lot of that around, like the Pyramids at Giza, or the Maya ruins. The Bible suffers also from being a document conceived by bronze age primitives. How impressive can their writings be to modern audiences? Donald Trump is a one-term LOSER |
May 15th, 2017 at 4:16:03 PM permalink | |
pew Member since: Jan 8, 2013 Threads: 4 Posts: 1232 | One third of the angels. No one is being forced to go to heaven and be with God. That's a choice each person has to make for themselves. I don't think God wants any unhappy campers hanging with Him for eternity so He does leave it up to you. P.S. what is AFAICT? |
May 15th, 2017 at 4:18:02 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
How dare you, it's stood the test of time, it has to be correct. That's what FrG is always saying about the NT. It's old, it can't be wrong. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
May 16th, 2017 at 4:06:41 PM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 |
Ha, I have to laugh at your mischaracterization of my argument. If you really believe that I just don't know what to say to you anymore. Sorry, I haven't had a chance to do much posting lately. I think the most recent question is a interesting one. What would cause Satan with full knowledge of God and His eternal plan to reject heaven and an all-powerful God? Satan would of course know that his decision would lead to his ultimate unhappiness and separation from all that is good, beautiful and right. Yet He choses himself over God. What is the old saying, "I'd rather rule in Hell then serve in Heaven." That is the mentality of the Evil One and let's be honest how many times do we adapt it for ourselves. We know certain things we do are wrong and will bring fleeting happiness at best and then more problems, but we do it anyway. Why do we do that? If you can come up with the answer to that question than you will also know why Satan chose his own glory over sharing in God's glory. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
May 16th, 2017 at 5:42:56 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
You've said many many times that the word of the NT has been around for 2000 years and it's still going strong and that alone makes it worth listening to. You can't remember saying that?
So you're saying Satan is a selfish, small minded creature who only see's the present and can't see what his actions will bring in the future? That's rather disappointing in the arch enemy of a god. He seems rather short sighted and unintelligent for a creature that's gotten so much said about him for the last 1500 years. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
May 16th, 2017 at 6:10:43 PM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 |
You have no nuance of complexity to your thought. You don't seem to grasp what I'm saying and since you are an intelligent man I can't help but believe it is willful ignorance, which is the worst kind.
Now I'm starting to think you aren't even really reading what I wrote. Make no mistake Satan is not some archenemy of God. That is silly. Satan is a created spiritual being who is nothing compared to the almighty. He is our archenemy and yes Satan is selfish, no he is not small minded or unintelligent. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
May 16th, 2017 at 6:43:49 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
You first have to understand, which you apparently do not, Mr Complexity of Thought, that I give as much credence to the story in the NT as I give to the Jack and Beanstalk story. You do realize if you believed the Jack story to be true, and convinced others it was, you could make it come alive with nuance and complexity. Just like you've done with the fiction in the NT.
So the talk among Christians of a constant struggle between god and Satan, a spiritual warfare, is just bunk then. I always suspected as much.
If he's so smart, why did he break with god. His vanity? That's a very insipid trait, only stupid beings let their vanity rule their lives. Satan doesn't sound smart at all. All the money in your fable lies in sticking with god, he holds all the cards, even an idiot can see that. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
May 16th, 2017 at 8:01:17 PM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 |
Your dismissal of the importance of the NT is staggering even for you.
For God's sake read and understand. There is a huge struggle between Christians and Satan.
Yes, his vanity and no, he is very smart. Think of all the times you have let vanity cause you to do stupid things. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
May 16th, 2017 at 10:59:54 PM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
World importance, yes. Importance to me, an atheist, almost none at all. Why would it. How much importance has what the Buddha said been to you.. See what I mean?
Yet this doesn't make Satan god's enemy? It certainly doesn't make him his friend. If somebody was trying to steal my converts, that's exactly what an enemy does.
I can guarantee my vanity has led me to make very few bad decisions, and certainly none that have been even close to life altering. That is the mark of a stupid person, not a 'very smart' being that you claim Satan to be. What you say is contradictory; how smart can Satan be if he lets his vanity dictate every move he makes. More and more this sounds like a fairy tale where the players are given overblown character traits to make some kind of moralistic point. And of course that's what the whole tale of god and Satan is, a myth made up to teach moral lessons. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |