Simple question?

Quote: petroglyph

We are watching "Mindhunter" for the second time and the FBI is interviewing Ed Kemper and other mass rapist/killers and it crosses my mind that maybe, these killing could have been prevented if these pervs had an outlet such as legalized brothels.

Illegal prostitution also leads to more sex slavery, including importing women thinking they will have some other work when they get here.

Quote: petroglyph

It's more like her indoctrination into a myth has her trapped into thinking something else has power over her addiction. It's been proven enough to me that there can be benefits of one addict helping another to give NA a pass. Narcotics are a terrible merciless poison. Someone willing to hold someones hand and encourage them to get medical assistance makes it easier. But no one else will get her clean, unless she wants to. Not Yaweh, NA, the church, not even prison. Just because benevolent groups have been shown to at times bring positive benefits to fighting this scourge, is not proof of Yaweh.

But it's interesting when you get right down to it, is why the people in those groups want to help.

Why they want to help is that they care for the person and want what is best for her. I'm glad you see the positive benefit of support groups. it is not enough just to hold someone's hands. Often they need to be reminded that they are loved and are worth loving. That their addiction doesn't define them and they are worth fighting for and their life is worth doing the hard work to get help. I agree that no one else will get her clean she has to want it, but faith in God or a higher power is hugely important to help them to want to be clean again and healthy.

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The problem here is, you think you have all the correct answers, others need not apply. And it always circles back to a straw god. How many people do you think got into drugs because of their church upbringing?

The answer to this question is not many. Studies have shown over and over again that a strong religious faith is a huge help in avoiding getting into drugs and being the best version of yourself. I don't have all the correct answers but living according to God's guidance and following the commandments clearly helps people live life to the fullest.

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It's not about you.

The best thing you have said and the truest!

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That's a bit circular don't ya think? The point here is for the woman to get her life back, be it a twelve step, a kick in the nuts, or a medical treatment plan with counseling. Bad drugs are bad, but they aren't mystical. If addiction is a disease rather than a troubled soul, society needs to look at it like a medical problem. You are assigning godlike power to an inanimate substance, that's been used for thousands of years longer than the bible story existed.

You might want to look at why people turn to drugs if you want to get to the root cause of addiction.

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It's not my straw man.

If you didn't make up this stuff about religion than you have bought into what someone has told you hook, line, and sinker without really bothering to think about it and learn about it yourself.

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Everything's evil, which is convenient for the church's business model. If your church is getting her the medical help she needs, good on them. And someone to help talk her through getting clean is hugely beneficial, if that's what she wants. I see women more prone to this need than men, btw. You see God in that picture, I see people doing things for their own benefit and putting a handle on it.

Everything is evil that causes harm to human beings. I think you tend to think that there is some self serving going one masquerading as helping another person and that is not what is going on here.

Quote: petroglyph

Everything's evil, which is convenient for the church's business model.

We've shown before that evil
is a concept, it doesn't exist
outside the conceptual model.
It's just a word to describe
something we don't like.

The Church loves the word,
they can pretend to fight 'evil'
and who can prove they aren't,
when it doesn't exist.

You really have to be careful when
using terms like evil. If you start
thinking there is some kind of
'force' for evil out there, separate
from yourself, that's the start of
mental instability thinking. It's
fantasy thinking, because it opens
the door to all kinds of other
fantasies and leads you to stop taking
responsibility for your life and
blaming everything on forces outside
your control.

Quote: Evenbob

You really have to be careful when
using terms like evil. If you start
thinking there is some kind of
'force' for evil out there, separate
from yourself, that's the start of
mental instability thinking. It's
fantasy thinking, because it opens
the door to all kinds of other
fantasies and leads you to stop taking
responsibility for your life and
blaming everything on forces outside
your control.

Sounds wise.

All that other stuff is distraction.

Quote: petroglyph

All that other stuff is distraction.

This is why the god religions are
so messed up. They say they're
all for personal responsibility,
but every other sentence out
of their mouth they're thanking
god or blaming the devil for
everything that happens in their
life. Just hang out with a Xtion
for a few days and they sound
like they have no idea what's
going on.

Quote: petroglyph

Sounds wise. All that other stuff is distraction.

The supernatural rules the god based
religions, without it they would be
lost. It's their 'go to' excuse for
everything. Credit or blame a force
that cannot be proven to exist.
Prove that it does, that's the proof
that it doesn't. I don't care about
all the cliche's that they use, in this
case it's true. Lack of proof IS lack
of existence.

Quote: Evenbob

The supernatural rules the god based
religions, without it they would be
lost. It's their 'go to' excuse for
everything. Credit or blame a force
that cannot be proven to exist.
Prove that it does, that's the proof
that it doesn't. I don't care about
all the cliche's that they use, in this
case it's true. Lack of proof IS lack
of existence.

I was reading earlier about the relationships between the black nobility and the church. I see no difference between that relationship and slavery. If you were poor, you just said yes. Peasants wished there was a god, it was the only way they would ever get warm or fed with royalty and the church taking everything they ever worked for.

Hey FrGamble, what's would be your religion's ruling on this statement.

"Life doesn't begin at conception, it begins with God. What right does anyone have to decide which part of this chain is not a divine gift whether sperm, infant or dying man."

Life does begin at conception, that is how it works. Everything begins with God and every human life is sacred. That includes unborn babies, infants, and dying men and every moment in between. Pace to Monty Python but every sperm is not sacred.