Authority

Do you think in general atheists have more issues with authority than the faithful?

I mean specifically distrust of authority, and even more specifically the notion that authorities either can't or won't help them.

I don't think such distrust "causes" atheism at all. But since religion is largely a matter of authority, distrust of authority would be an emotional aid in making the rational decision to stop believing in "God." The various arguments from authority for "God" would be nearly powerless.

Quote: Nareed

Do you think in general atheists have more issues with authority than the faithful?

What a loaded question ;)

I think many would think that I do have problems, perhaps even major problems. I not only break rules, but I often actively look for them just so I can break them. Well, maybe not "often", but certainly when concerning something I'm passionate about (like gun law). I dunno, I just play by my own rules.

FrG would likely say "See!" to all this, but it's only a partial picture. For every "bad" that I do because it's my life and I'll do what I want, there are countless other "good" that I do for the same reason. And I won't even say "it all evens out", because I am way, way ahead on the good, enough so that I'm thinking all of 2016 might be dedicated to the bad ;)

But this has nothing to do with atheism, or at least not mine. You could say I've been an atheist since birth, having never taken to theism, but I think I made the conscious decision somewhere around 8-10yrs of age. That, at least for me, was far too young to be having issues with authority. And whatever "acting out" stage I experienced didn't start until deep into my teens.

No. I'm an atheist because every bit I've heard about any religion has made me laugh. I'm still not sure it's not all some huge prank that no one's let me in on yet.

Quote: Nareed

Do you think in general atheists have more issues with authority than the faithful?

I've never trusted authority, I've always
found it wanting. It's a problem I have
with FrG, and have said as much. His
church has told him he's the moral
arbiter in every situation and he believed
them. Who gave them the authority to
tell him that? Nobody, they made it up
themselves to rein in the weak and
the gullible. Be your own moral authority,
you'll be far better off.

Quote: Face

You could say I've been an atheist since birth,

We are all atheists from birth. No one is born believing in Marduk, Jehovah, Athena or The Flying Spaghetti Monster.

The vast majority of people, though, are taught to believe in some deity the same way they're taught to read and write. Letting go of such beliefs is not always easy, and few people have the fortune to retain their inherent atheism.

I think perhaps a better question would not be "issues with authority", but rather "questions authority". Because on that, I can give a big "Hell yes!"

I question everything, as I feel one should. From there is gets processed through my logic and moral make-sense-arator, and if it makes sense, then that becomes my "law". Stealing, for instance. I might want something from another, and that other may not be using it or ever use it, but it makes sense that that item nonetheless has "value", and said value belongs to another. Step by step, it all makes sense. Same could be said for assault, battery, rape, fraud, and on and on. The things I hold as law are things I can lay out, step by step, and wind up at the end with sense.

Other things surely don't. "Machine guns" are illegal. Why? More dangerous? More deadly? Less safe? Nope, nope, and nope. So I don't abide that law. Drinking a beer on the way to the crick. Does the 4-6oz I manage to get down behind the wheel make me a loose cannon? Does the simple fact that a container of beer is open in my vehicle put you at risk? Lol, no. I can drink the whole thing on my porch and then go, and The Man says that's OK. But having less, only having it with me, is suddenly a five figure fine and a felony? GTFO and kiss my grits.

My very first intro to religion was exactly the same. I heard about it, I got curious about it, and I found out about it. And my reaction then at the ripe old age of 7 is the same one I hold today. Still stuck on how people believe it and waiting for an adult to show up and tell me "Just kidding!" =p

Quote: Face

My very first intro to religion was exactly the same. I heard about it, I got curious about it, and I found out about it. And my reaction then at the ripe old age of 7 is the same one I hold today. Still stuck on how people believe it and waiting for an adult to show up and tell me "Just kidding!" =p

99% are born into it, they literally
don't know any better. For me to
accept it as a full grown adult is
frightening because it would
mean I have lost my grip on reality.

The world of the Christianity in not
reality to me, it's craziness.

Quote: Face

My very first intro to religion was exactly the same. I heard about it, I got curious about it, and I found out about it. And my reaction then at the ripe old age of 7 is the same one I hold today. Still stuck on how people believe it and waiting for an adult to show up and tell me "Just kidding!" =p

My big issue with authority is that I do accept it, but I don't trust it, and by experience I know it will rarely help.

So even though I had doubts about religion from an early age, say around 9 or so, any questions about it, however innocent, were met with "DON'T ASK SUCH QUESTIONS!!!" Even those rare times I got an actual explanation, it boiled down to a polite, calm way of saying "Don't ask such questions." It took me until age 16 to finally get the nerve to quit religion for good.

Quote: Nareed

My big issue with authority is that I do accept it, but I don't trust it, .

I had some experiences at an early age
with people I trusted lying to me. It
taught to verify, then trust.

Quote: Evenbob

I had some experiences at an early age
with people I trusted lying to me. It
taught to verify, then trust.

This is really turning me onto nature vs nurture. It is easy to see how someone born into is almost assuredly going to follow it. It likewise stands that one with very poor experiences, which you and Nareed have admitted, would solidify one the other way.

But then there's me. While I have had some pretty poor experiences (at least one I'd qualify as "horrifying"), that initial foray into it, and the subsequent dismissal, all happened with clear mind and memory. I knew not of the good, the bad, the implications, the abuse, the joys, nothing. And I was 7, not exactly the age of reason or deep, philosophical thought.

There has to be a natural component to all this. Has to be. Otherwise, why would I as a mere child, speaking to the one I trusted implicitly, not accept what I was being told?

Interesting question, and yes, I do think there's a correlation of sorts. Every religion I can think of requires some kind of volition surrender to a higher power; maybe Zen Buddhism is an exception to that, but I don't know enough about the details to say that for sure. In some ways, atheism is a rejection of either the concept of surrender or the need to do it, though being religious doesn't necessarily mean a lack of self-reliance. I thought your comments about (paraphrasing) "being irreligious is not the same as lacking in spirituality" were also on point.