Newtown, Conn

Quote: AZDuffman

Quote: MidwestAP

Obviously the gun itself is not responsible, but it's part of the equation (and yes they have changed). It's a weapon that is used much more frequently with more destructive force than any other kind of weapon. Thinking otherwise is burying your head in the sand.

I'm have no preconception that all violence would cease nor that all gun violence would go away. Bad people will still find ways to do bad things, but if we can make it more difficult, shouldn't we try? And if we can decrease the amount of deaths through ANY and ALL measures that are effective, wouldn't that be progress? You can't say for 100% certainty that it wouldn't have an impact nor can I say with 100% certainty that it would. But putting controls on weapons (limiting firepower, restricting access) in my opinion is part (and only part) of the solution.

As far as the commentary about society and lack of self-accoutability, I couldn't agree more. And addressing those issues, along with mental health issues are all parts of the equation that need to be addressed.

My and anybody's chances of dying by a gun are minimal. We cannot remove all risk in life. Our risks in the USA are so few the human brain tries to find something to worry about.

My and anybody's chances of dying by Asteroid strike are minimal. Should we immediately decommission all efforts being currently undertaken to deal with that problem (there are ongoing efforts btw).

My and anybody's chances of dying by Tsunami are minimal. Should we decommission all Tsunami warning efforts?

Likewise, ... hurricanes.

Likewise... tornadoes.

Likewise.... lightning strikes.

Need I continue?

Quote: midwestgb

Quote: AZDuffman

Quote: MidwestAP

Obviously the gun itself is not responsible, but it's part of the equation (and yes they have changed). It's a weapon that is used much more frequently with more destructive force than any other kind of weapon. Thinking otherwise is burying your head in the sand.

I'm have no preconception that all violence would cease nor that all gun violence would go away. Bad people will still find ways to do bad things, but if we can make it more difficult, shouldn't we try? And if we can decrease the amount of deaths through ANY and ALL measures that are effective, wouldn't that be progress? You can't say for 100% certainty that it wouldn't have an impact nor can I say with 100% certainty that it would. But putting controls on weapons (limiting firepower, restricting access) in my opinion is part (and only part) of the solution.

As far as the commentary about society and lack of self-accoutability, I couldn't agree more. And addressing those issues, along with mental health issues are all parts of the equation that need to be addressed.

My and anybody's chances of dying by a gun are minimal. We cannot remove all risk in life. Our risks in the USA are so few the human brain tries to find something to worry about.

My and anybody's chances of dying by Asteroid strike are minimal. Should we immediately decommission all efforts being currently undertaken to deal with that problem (there are ongoing efforts btw).

My and anybody's chances of dying by Tsunami are minimal. Should we decommission all Tsunami warning efforts?

Likewise, ... hurricanes.

Likewise... tornadoes.

Likewise.... lightning strikes.

Need I continue?

Asteroids and tsunamis do not take away other people's rights when you monitor for them. And I worry about neither. If an asteroid hits we are dead. Period.

Quote: FarFromVegas

Quote: AZDuffman

Quote: MidwestAP

Obviously the gun itself is not responsible, but it's part of the equation (and yes they have changed). It's a weapon that is used much more frequently with more destructive force than any other kind of weapon. Thinking otherwise is burying your head in the sand.

I'm have no preconception that all violence would cease nor that all gun violence would go away. Bad people will still find ways to do bad things, but if we can make it more difficult, shouldn't we try? And if we can decrease the amount of deaths through ANY and ALL measures that are effective, wouldn't that be progress? You can't say for 100% certainty that it wouldn't have an impact nor can I say with 100% certainty that it would. But putting controls on weapons (limiting firepower, restricting access) in my opinion is part (and only part) of the solution.

As far as the commentary about society and lack of self-accoutability, I couldn't agree more. And addressing those issues, along with mental health issues are all parts of the equation that need to be addressed.

My and anybody's chances of dying by a gun are minimal. We cannot remove all risk in life. Our risks in the USA are so few the human brain tries to find something to worry about.

My brain doesn't have to find something to worry about. You're the one who had to find something as ludicrous as a window to worry about to try to make your darling gun appear to be safe by comparison. My chance of dying by a gun is greater than dying by a car (another one of your straw men) in this state now. I do not need to manufacture a worry.

I won't waste any more time on you--you have no power. We've already sent out letters to the people who can actually do something.

Enjoy being on the minority side once again.

Never said I am worried about a window. You are incorrect in your facts. You are three times more likely to die in a car accident so you rely should start walking. Enjoy being on the side that is happy to lose their rights. Those of us who prefer freedom if we are the minority that is a sad day


Merry Christmas in any case.

I love my kids because they "get" things.

Every app that the kids download shows up on my phone since I was the last person to get a smartphone. So when this app named Rage Wars showed up on my screen I knew which kid had downloaded it. This
is not the thing that should be on the screen of a kids with Aspergers these days. And really any kid any day. So I told him it had to go. He said he was old enough for M games since he was 17, but I told him he couldn't have it at school. Then he said he was allowed to have his phone at school nowadays, and I told him his choice was to keep the game and leave the phone home, or get rid of the game and maybe get a game for a PS3 instead, and he said, "good deal." He got it.

My oldest son has a BB gun and a jungle knife and a stun gun and a decorative katana on his wall. He's your typical 19 year old male, although he uses the jungle knife for clearing brush in the desert. (Most kids his age don't help with the yardwork. But I digress. ) He knows he is a legal adult with a legal right to possess these things, but he also knows not to bring them to school and keep them in his dorm. Especially since he lives in the dorm where the massacre started at Virginia Tech, but they aren't allowed in any dorm. They are stored away from younger siblings. He gets it.

With rights come responsibilities. My kids don't stamp their feet and petulantly demand everything they have a right to. They are awesome.

I ain't gonna change anyone's mind who's made it already. But I would ask you to consider something...

I live in WNY, Erie County, same county as Buffalo. As such, it's one of the more difficult places in the nation to get a gun. There's restictions on type, capacity, function, you name it. My unrestricted concealed carry permit, one which several states offer simply by right, is something for which I had to pay ~$300, wait 20 months, attended "training sessions", get finger printed, picture taken... it's a process. Any pistol I buy takes requires, at minimum, a 140 mile round trip to procure.

It's been, what, a week, 10 days since Sandy Hook? All of the school have "increased security", side doors have been locked, entry has been monitored. I actually got profiled today; while all the moms got buzzed in as soon as they reached the door, me in my skull cap and hoody had to wait while they asked me a bunch of questions before I was let in to retrieve my son. I laughed on the inside. Not a funny laugh, but I laughed nonetheless.

My training in SD has changed who I am. For a long time I've been aware that our "safety" is but an illusion. The only thing that has kept me safe for most of my life is simply the lack of will of those around me to do me harm. I am trained to be situationally aware. There's not a place that I go, whether work, home, school, shopping, or hockey, where I'm not aware of all entrances, exits, ways in, ways out, how someone can get in and how I can get out. In all the places I go, there is but one place I let down my guard. It is the County Courts, where the entrance is guarded by 2-4 armed Sheriffs, x-ray, and metal detectors.

With the amount of restrictions and "control" these people have put on me, with the amount of "increased security" at school, it has done nothing more than create the illusion of safety. That. Is. It. The guns I own range from high power sniper type rifles to run of the mill shotguns to low powered pistols. With no difficulty whatsoever, I could have snuck in any single gun I own, as well as many rounds as I cared, and systematically killed every single person in the pre-k wing of my son's school. Comitting such an atrocity would have been orders of magnitude easier than obtaining an antibiotic prescription for my sinus infection.

There is only one thing preventing the occurrance of such acts, and that's simply the lack of will to do so.

I don't care if you're anti-gun, if you don't care about the rights of your fellow American, or if you don't mind attacking the Constitution. You are a human and an American and are free to follow your own path. But I'd ask you (almost beg you), as a parent myself, if you wish to do something about these atrocities, if you wish to do whatever it takes to prevent them, at least do something with a hope of working. Attack the gun if it makes you feel better. But don't fool yourself into thinking you're fixing the problem.

If all people were allowed access to high quality high explosives, we coud prove that entire gun shows could be taken out by ordinary people with a bomb and a driving will to do so.

If you don't think it's the ban on explosive materials, than what is it that keeps more bombers at bay. Well, for one thing, they can resort to guns first, which is much easier than planning bombings. But really, there are ready made materials which would make it easy for anyone if we wanted to give access to them.

Quote: rxwine

If all people were allowed access to high quality high explosives, we coud prove that entire gun shows could be taken out by ordinary people with a bomb and a driving will to do so.

If you don't think it's the ban on explosive materials, than what is it that keeps more bombers at bay. Well, for one thing, they can resort to guns first, which is much easier than planning bombings. But really, there are ready made materials which would make it easy for anyone if we wanted to give access to them.

Read STRATFOR. Making a bomb is not a simple trade. Making one that will work as desired is a high art form. It isn't like on tv where they put a big digital readout and it goes boom. The mix of materials a d trigger all have to be exactly so

@face. Ny is crazy strict on guns. Guy I worked with wanted to shoot one. Agonized over what it was like as he was an anti-gun liber but kept asking. In pa we would have hit the woods an been done. In by I had to say find a range.

Quote: Face

I ain't gonna change anyone's mind who's made it already. But I would ask you to consider something...

I live in WNY, Erie County, same county as Buffalo. As such, it's one of the more difficult places in the nation to get a gun. There's restictions on type, capacity, function, you name it. My unrestricted concealed carry permit, one which several states offer simply by right, is something for which I had to pay ~$300, wait 20 months, attended "training sessions", get finger printed, picture taken... it's a process. Any pistol I buy takes requires, at minimum, a 140 mile round trip to procure.

It's been, what, a week, 10 days since Sandy Hook? All of the school have "increased security", side doors have been locked, entry has been monitored. I actually got profiled today; while all the moms got buzzed in as soon as they reached the door, me in my skull cap and hoody had to wait while they asked me a bunch of questions before I was let in to retrieve my son. I laughed on the inside. Not a funny laugh, but I laughed nonetheless.

My training in SD has changed who I am. For a long time I've been aware that our "safety" is but an illusion. The only thing that has kept me safe for most of my life is simply the lack of will of those around me to do me harm. I am trained to be situationally aware. There's not a place that I go, whether work, home, school, shopping, or hockey, where I'm not aware of all entrances, exits, ways in, ways out, how someone can get in and how I can get out. In all the places I go, there is but one place I let down my guard. It is the County Courts, where the entrance is guarded by 2-4 armed Sheriffs, x-ray, and metal detectors.

With the amount of restrictions and "control" these people have put on me, with the amount of "increased security" at school, it has done nothing more than create the illusion of safety. That. Is. It. The guns I own range from high power sniper type rifles to run of the mill shotguns to low powered pistols. With no difficulty whatsoever, I could have snuck in any single gun I own, as well as many rounds as I cared, and systematically killed every single person in the pre-k wing of my son's school. Comitting such an atrocity would have been orders of magnitude easier than obtaining an antibiotic prescription for my sinus infection.

There is only one thing preventing the occurrance of such acts, and that's simply the lack of will to do so.

I don't care if you're anti-gun, if you don't care about the rights of your fellow American, or if you don't mind attacking the Constitution. You are a human and an American and are free to follow your own path. But I'd ask you (almost beg you), as a parent myself, if you wish to do something about these atrocities, if you wish to do whatever it takes to prevent them, at least do something with a hope of working. Attack the gun if it makes you feel better. But don't fool yourself into thinking you're fixing the problem.

You are a security professional. You have had "training" (you added the quotations) and I'm willing to bet all your guns are registered and kept away from your (adorable!) son. I live in the same city as SEAL Team 6 and I have no doubt there is plenty of firepower around here, and I can only hope the majority is in the hands of trained professionals because our Governor is the genius who wants to arm the teachers. But what the hell does a suburban housewife need that kind of firepower for? Fun at the range? You can go rent one of those things for a couple of hours in Vegas and leave it there locked away if you can't live without your toy. I let my son go skeet shooting with his baseball team and those guys only let one kid at a time onto the range. That's the way to do it! I never felt he was in any danger even though the kids were 12 and 13.

I doubt our Founding Fathers envisioned a banana republic in which heavily armed men patrolled the streets to keep us safe from...other heavily armed men. That's what the circular argument about "we need more guns to keep us safe from guns" might eventually lead to. They just didn't want America to become a serfdom where you are dependent on the feudal lord for food and protection. Now we've got the Safeway and a pretty decent military to keep us safe from foreign threats.

Quote: FarFromVegas

Quote: Face

I ain't gonna change anyone's mind who's made it already. But I would ask you to consider something...

I live in WNY, Erie County, same county as Buffalo. As such, it's one of the more difficult places in the nation to get a gun. There's restictions on type, capacity, function, you name it. My unrestricted concealed carry permit, one which several states offer simply by right, is something for which I had to pay ~$300, wait 20 months, attended "training sessions", get finger printed, picture taken... it's a process. Any pistol I buy takes requires, at minimum, a 140 mile round trip to procure.

It's been, what, a week, 10 days since Sandy Hook? All of the school have "increased security", side doors have been locked, entry has been monitored. I actually got profiled today; while all the moms got buzzed in as soon as they reached the door, me in my skull cap and hoody had to wait while they asked me a bunch of questions before I was let in to retrieve my son. I laughed on the inside. Not a funny laugh, but I laughed nonetheless.

My training in SD has changed who I am. For a long time I've been aware that our "safety" is but an illusion. The only thing that has kept me safe for most of my life is simply the lack of will of those around me to do me harm. I am trained to be situationally aware. There's not a place that I go, whether work, home, school, shopping, or hockey, where I'm not aware of all entrances, exits, ways in, ways out, how someone can get in and how I can get out. In all the places I go, there is but one place I let down my guard. It is the County Courts, where the entrance is guarded by 2-4 armed Sheriffs, x-ray, and metal detectors.

With the amount of restrictions and "control" these people have put on me, with the amount of "increased security" at school, it has done nothing more than create the illusion of safety. That. Is. It. The guns I own range from high power sniper type rifles to run of the mill shotguns to low powered pistols. With no difficulty whatsoever, I could have snuck in any single gun I own, as well as many rounds as I cared, and systematically killed every single person in the pre-k wing of my son's school. Comitting such an atrocity would have been orders of magnitude easier than obtaining an antibiotic prescription for my sinus infection.

There is only one thing preventing the occurrance of such acts, and that's simply the lack of will to do so.


I don't care if you're anti-gun, if you don't care about the rights of your fellow American, or if you don't mind attacking the Constitution. You are a human and an American and are free to follow your own path. But I'd ask you (almost beg you), as a parent myself, if you wish to do something about these atrocities, if you wish to do whatever it takes to prevent them, at least do something with a hope of working. Attack the gun if it makes you feel better. But don't fool yourself into thinking you're fixing the problem.

You are a security professional. You have had "training" (you added the quotations) and I'm willing to bet all your guns are registered and kept away from your (adorable!) son. I live in the same city as SEAL Team 6 and I have no doubt there is plenty of firepower around here, and I can only hope the majority is in the hands of trained professionals because our Governor is the genius who wants to arm the teachers. But what the hell does a suburban housewife need that kind of firepower for? Fun at the range? You can go rent one of those things for a couple of hours in Vegas and leave it there locked away if you can't live without your toy. I let my son go skeet shooting with his baseball team and those guys only let one kid at a time onto the range. That's the way to do it! I never felt he was in any danger even though the kids were 12 and 13.

I doubt our Founding Fathers envisioned a banana republic in which heavily armed men patrolled the streets to keep us safe from...other heavily armed men. That's what the circular argument about "we need more guns to keep us safe from guns" might eventually lead to. They just didn't want America to become a serfdom where you are dependent on the feudal lord for food and protection. Now we've got the Safeway and a pretty decent military to keep us safe from foreign threats.

Thanks but why not let the suburban housewife decide what she "needs." Given that the parts of the USA with the most restrictive gun laws tend to ha e the most gun violence her answer may differ from yours.

Quote: AZDuffman

Read STRATFOR. Making a bomb is not a simple trade. Making one that will work as desired is a high art form. It isn't like on tv where they put a big digital readout and it goes boom. The mix of materials a d trigger all have to be exactly so

If you could access premade bombs made by professional bombmakers, (no different than having gun manufacturers), we would have more bombings.

The only thing that prevents it, is, we don't. We don't allow unrestricted use.

Banning works. Real banning, Not fake banning where I can cross a state border, or maybe even purchase on the internet with little scruitiny.

There's a guy from the Virginia Tech shooting showing how there are NO REAL GUN BANS.

Quote:

Colin Goddard knows what it's like to be in a classroom when an armed man bursts through the door and starts randomly shooting people. Goddard was a student at Virginia Tech when a gunman shot him and killed 32 people in the deadliest mass shooting in U.S. history.

"It was the most terrifying nine minutes of my life," Goddard told Terry Moran of "Nightline" Wednesday. "One moment you're conjugating French verbs, the next you're shot."


Four of Seung-Hui Cho's bullets hit Goddard April 16, 2007. Three of the bullets are still in him and serve as a constant reminder in his work with the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.

Goddard, 26, does more than lobby and appear in public-service announcements. He says he goes undercover to show how easy it is to buy guns without any background check. It's the subject of his documentary called "Living for 32," after the 32 people who died at Virginia Tech in Blacksburg.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/virginia-tech-survivor-colin-goddard-fights-back-guns/story?id=18022765