Begs the Question

January 12th, 2013 at 12:47:03 PM permalink
odiousgambit
Member since: Oct 28, 2012
Threads: 154
Posts: 5055
The people who would stop the wrong usage of this phrase are losing the battle. One of these days the incorrect usage will be acceptable?

In case you havent heard about this, the incorrect use of the phrase "begs the question" is to use it when you mean, "that raises the question".

I've decided it is hopeless to make sense of the problem if you try to make sense of the phrase. I havent heard anyone else say this, but IMO it is a case of a bad translation from the Greek. Aristotle trotted this out, it is a type of fallacy involving circular reasoning.

If you want to use it correctly, forget the apparent meaning in English of what you are saying. If you have someone making a statement that purports to be logical, but uses disguised circular reasoning, it's OK to use the phrase [but see below]. Someone might say "We know the Earth is flat, everybody who is respected has always said so". Countering that you might say "that's circular reasoning, it begs the question". The best recommendation, though, seems to be to just say "that's circular reasoning" since almost nobody understands you correctly if you add the latter part.

At the bottom in Wikipedia: "Academic linguist Mark Liberman recommends avoiding the phrase entirely... its intended meaning is unintelligible and therefore it is now 'such a confusing way to say it that only a few pedants understand the phrase.' "

Guilty of misuse myself, I hereby vow to use it no more.

http://begthequestion.info/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question
I'm Still Standing, Yeah, Yeah, Yeah [it's an old guy chant for me]
January 12th, 2013 at 2:56:38 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: odiousgambit
The people who would stop the wrong usage of this phrase are losing the battle. One of these days the incorrect usage will be acceptable?



Now if we can get people to say champing-at-the-bit properly........
The President is a fink.
January 12th, 2013 at 5:45:31 PM permalink
98Clubs
Member since: Nov 11, 2012
Threads: 2
Posts: 75
or get them to realize that ain't IS a contraction. (of "aims not (to be))"
There are four things certain in life... Death, Taxes, the Resistance to them, and Stupidity.
January 12th, 2013 at 5:51:40 PM permalink
TheCesspit
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 23
Posts: 1929
Quote: 98Clubs
or get them to realize that ain't IS a contraction. (of "aims not (to be))"


I thought it was a contraction of "is not"/"have not"/"has not".

Or at least in British English.
It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die.... it's called Life
January 12th, 2013 at 6:17:41 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: TheCesspit
I thought it was a contraction of "is not"/"have not"/"has not".

Or at least in British English.


In school we used to get scolded for using it, as it was on again/off again as to if it was a word or not.

The saying we had was, "Ain't ain't a word and it ain't in the dictionary so I ain't gonna use it!"
The President is a fink.
January 13th, 2013 at 12:05:02 AM permalink
TheCesspit
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 23
Posts: 1929
Quote: AZDuffman
In school we used to get scolded for using it, as it was on again/off again as to if it was a word or not.

The saying we had was, "Ain't ain't a word and it ain't in the dictionary so I ain't gonna use it!"


Yeah, we were as well. It was considered a low-class slang word. Certianly the rough kids used it a lot, while the middle-class kids were far too proper to use such vernacular.
It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die.... it's called Life