The Holy Trinity

I've come to the conclusion that this entire thread can be summed up as follows:

FrGamble: God has always existed
EvenBob/AOS: God has never existed
Wizard: Undecided as to whether or not God has ever existed (but loves a good, intellectual debate)

Quote: aceofspades

I've come to the conclusion that this entire thread can be summed up as follows:

FrGamble: God has always existed
EvenBob/AOS: God has never existed

That is not a bad summary.

I might just add that my belief, which the vast majority of human beings past and present share, has logical arguments, history, scientific evidence, testimonies, miracles, and personal experiences to support it.

As far as I can tell Evenbob has presented a list of some famous atheist testimonies to support your position.

Quote: FrGamble

That is not a bad summary.

I might just add that my belief, which the vast majority of human beings past and present share, has logical arguments, history, scientific evidence, testimonies, miracles, and personal experiences to support it.

As far as I can tell Evenbob has presented a list of some famous atheist testimonies to support your position.

I will ask this again as I am not sure you saw it the first time - what is the empirical scientific evidence (put through the scientific method) that God exists?

Quote: FrGamble

I have and you have never once given a coherent or logical answer

Just like you have yet to show
evidence for god. Real evidence,
not what passes for evidence
in the biased Vatican. You people
used to have 'evidence' that witches
caused still births and ruined crops.
You are very unreliable in the evidence
dept..

Quote:

I'm glad I nailed it,

I nodded off for the rest
of that paragraph, it's
something you've said
to me dozens of times.

Quote:

Do you really think this or are you joking?

That many people are incapable of kicking
beliefs they were indoctrinated with as
kids? You've never heard the term 'recovering
Catholic'? Some people battle their entire
lives to get rid of the Catholic guilt instilled
in them as children. There's is no joke about
it.

"Catholic guilt is an expression used to identify the reported excess guilt felt by Catholics and lapsed Catholics"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_guilt#Examples

It's a fact that Catholic guilt can cause depression:

"My depression stems from my Catholic upbringing, specifically, the Catholic view of suffering. It took time to overcome various Catholic behaviors and biases (like being ashamed of my body and sexuality, praying before meals, homophobia, sexism, fear of hell, etc.). I got over all those things and my life has drastically improved over the six years I have been atheist."

There has been a ton written on this,
surely you're aware of the misery your
religion causes some people.

Quote: aceofspades

I've come to the conclusion that this entire thread can be summed up as follows:

FrGamble: God has always existed
EvenBob/AOS: God has never existed

What about me?

Wizard: I don't know

Quote: aceofspades

I will ask this again as I am not sure you saw it the first time - what is the empirical scientific evidence (put through the scientific method) that God exists?

The scientific discovery that the universe is expanding is pretty clear evidence that it had a beginning. This is pretty much the consensus of modern cosmologists.

Quote: Evenbob

Just like you have yet to show
evidence for god. Real evidence,
not what passes for evidence
in the biased Vatican.

You are using ad hominem here and it has nothing to do with the reliability or reality of evidence. Ironically, the only evidence you have given is testimony of very smart people who doubt the existence of God. I say ironic because you always say that testimony is the worst evidence. I don't know why you say this considering every court case depends on it, but let's not go there again. I don't really care if you don't accept my evidence for whatever reasons you tell yourself. How about if you then just give me your evidence? If it is a logical argument or scientific evidence I promise you I will accept it. You just keep dancing around this issue talking about the myth that the Church promoted lots of witch burnings. Stay on target and present evidence to support your claims!

Quote:

I nodded off for the rest
of that paragraph, it's
something you've said
to me dozens of times.

Yeah, I am sure you did. The first time I made this clear to you was just a few days ago. Don't worry I know what it means when you say something like this.

Quote:

That many people are incapable of kicking
beliefs they were indoctrinated with as
kids?

Yes, do you think that people go their whole lives just believing whatever they were taught as kids? I can tell you working with young adults that this is not true.

Quote:

Some people battle their entire
lives to get rid of the Catholic guilt instilled
in them as children. There's is no joke about
it.

As your quote you game showed this Catholic guilt is often really just not accepting the Church teaching or being indoctrinated that it is something it is not. The fact that people hold some "guilt" about this is because maybe deep down they realize they are wrong and trying to blame the Church. I am aware of the misery that leaving the Church does cause with some people. I wish they would come back or at least learn what the Church really teaches.

Quote: FrGamble

The scientific discovery that the universe is expanding is pretty clear evidence that it had a beginning. This is pretty much the consensus of modern cosmologists.

Do try and keep up, that's old news.

"That period, known as cosmic inflation, came to an end and gave rise to the hot Big Bang,
but never created an arbitrarily hot, dense state, nor did it create a singularity

Quote: Wizard

What about me?

Wizard: I don't know

You do know, we all know. You just want
to not think about it.

Quote: Wizard

What about me?

Wizard: I don't know

Oh no disrespect Wiz -- indeed I am editing my post