The Holy Trinity

On the now-extant forum I belonged to, Tom quoted scripture with a fire hose to argue his main points that:

1. There is only one god.
2. Speaking in tongues is a requirement to be saved.
3. Baptism should be "in the name of Jesus" only and by full water immersion.

He is a devote member of the Oneness Pentecostals. That Wikipedia link will tell you more than I can. With that, I think I've said all I have to say on the trinity.

Quote: FrGamble

In regards to the Trinity itself the most important thing to understand is .

That it's not possible to understand it.

The trinity is an intentional contradiction of logic that is supposed to be accepted on faith as there is no rationalization for it. In the unity of the Godhead, there are three Persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, these Three persons being truly distinct one from another. 'The Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Spirit is God, and yet there are not three Gods but one God.'

Illogical poppycock nonsense designed
to make priests look smart and their
flock feel stupid. How smart the priests
must be to understand this drivel, how
dumb and humbled the flock feels
in their ignorance. This is how religion
works.

Wiz, when you first mentioned him I thought he might believe some of the things you mentioned. I'm always amazed at how people can claim to be so Biblical on some things and so non Biblical on others. I find it so much better to br grounded in the Scriptures for everything.

Evenbob, if you think for a second priests and lay theologians aren't humbled by the Trinity you are sadly mistaken.

Quote: FrGamble

Evenbob, if you think for a second priests and lay theologians aren't humbled by the Trinity you are sadly mistaken.

God people are humbled by sunsets because
they say god 'painted' it just for them. (I've
heard them say it) God people are humbled
by everything they blame on god, why
wouldn't they be humbled by a manmade
riddle that was invented so as to have no
solution, the trinity. It sounds on the surface
so profound, so dang mysterious, it's
just god being his godly self. Too bad it's
just men making something up to fool the
little people, and the priests who don't even
know they're being played by their own
religion. It worked on you, didn't it? You
can't explain the trinity, yet you believe
it totally.

And please spare me your explanation of it
again, and your faux disbelief that I just
don't 'get it'. Nobody gets it, that's the point
of it's invention.

A.W. Tozer, in his book The Knowledge of the Holy , writes that the Trinity is an “ incomprehensible mystery ” and that attempts to understand it “ must remain forever futile. ” He admits that churches, “ without pretending to understand,” have nevertheless continued to teach this doctrine.

Ooh, ahh, who doesn't love a mystery!

Bob, you're hypocrisy knows no bounds! Just a few days ago you were extolling Zen masters who purposely say or teach seemingly impossible sayings. I think you even said how great it was they have no solution. Anyway, the Trinity is not some Zen exercise it just go to show how unclear you are in your thinking, confused, and prejudiced.

Don't worry I'm not going to explain anything to you. I've learned through our conversation about sin that you won't listen and when you realize you are wrong you'll just stop talking, change the subject, or ignore everything that was said. Suffice it to say that the basic understanding of the Trinity is not an incomprehensible mystery.

Quote: FrGamble

Don't worry I'm not going to explain anything to you. .

You can't explain it, nobody can. Zen
will tell you the questions are designed
to be meaningless, to have no answer.
Not so trinity, you just said it's 'not an
incomprehensible mystery'. But whole
books have been written on what a
hoax it is, how it was made up to fool
people into believing god is such a deep
concept only the Church leaders can
really figure it out. It's a rope a dope
ploy.

Wow, whole books have been written against the largest religion in the world. Many, many, many more books have been written explaining it, including one called the Bible. Maybe you should read some of those.

Why do you keep saying that only Church leaders can really figure out the Trinity? There are countless lay people who believe in and understand the Trinity.

Quote: FrGamble

Why do you keep saying that only Church leaders can really figure out the Trinity?

They CAN'T figure it out or they
would be able to explain it. They
SAY they can, that's the point of
the whole thing. You can't explain
it, you've tried. The smart people in the
Church admit it cannot be explained,
it's the big mystery.

Magicians do the same thing. Shroud
everything they do in mystery to give
it an aura it doesn't deserve. With the
trinity, god is oh so deep, oh so
mysterious, when the truth is, there
is no god at all to be either deep or
mysterious.

God the source of all life and being is kind of deep and mysterious. However, the Trinity can be explained and is understood everyone I know. I bet if you try you can explain it as well. Are you saying you can't completely understand everything about the Trinity? Well that is different. You can't explain why you exist and the universe exists, but it is real. You can't explain the formation of Jupiter completely, but it exists. I don't see why you keep saying the Trinity is unexplained or impossible to understand. Give it a try and bet you can get the basics.

Quote: FrGamble

However, the Trinity can be explained and is understood everyone I know.

Even in my most religious days, I never had a clear grasp of it. Everybody, but me, claimed to get it, but I'm not so sure they did. One analogy I recall was ice, liquid water, and steam are all the same thing (H2O), but in different forms. That analogy never helped me much.