How does a god know he/she is all there is?

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May 9th, 2017 at 3:51:37 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 107
Posts: 11114
Quote: FrGamble
I would think one of those things that truly crushes our soul are riches.


Lol, right. Bill Gates looks like his soul
has been totally crushed as he and
his wife oversee the billions in the
Gates Foundation that's helping people
on a worldwide scale. I could go and
on with how ridiculous your statement
is.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
May 9th, 2017 at 5:29:10 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 44
Posts: 5057
Quote: Nareed
That's easy to say, when you know you'll never go hungry, will always have medical care available, and you don't go to bed every night hoping your children will all still be alive come morning.


It easy to say when you see people wasting money and selfishly spend it on useless things when the above is true. Talk about soul-crushing, more like soul destroying. There is nothing worse for someone to have lots of money and then try to make themselves happy with it, it is sad, and crushes the soul of themselves and the lives of those you mention above.

Thank God for people like Bill Gates and some other very wealthy people who use their riches to serve the materially poor.
May 9th, 2017 at 5:38:18 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 107
Posts: 11114
Quote: FrGamble
There is nothing worse for someone to have lots of money and then try to make themselves happy with it,


But money for many people DOES make
them happy! It allows them to indulge
in their hobbies, to keep their wife happy,
to live where they want. It makes some
people miserable, so you want to dump
the whole human race in the same basket
with them. I know far far more happy
people with money than happy people
without it. An so do YOU..
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
May 9th, 2017 at 7:19:13 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 44
Posts: 5057
Quote: Evenbob
But money for many people DOES make
them happy! It allows them to indulge
in their hobbies, to keep their wife happy,
to live where they want. It makes some
people miserable, so you want to dump
the whole human race in the same basket
with them. I know far far more happy
people with money than happy people
without it. An so do YOU..


Indulging in hobbies, living where they want, and keeping the wife happy are great. Notice you didn't say giving to the materially poor or those in need as part of your use of money, that is essential! I think we are talking about different things. You used the example of Bill Gates, imagine if Bill Gates just kept all his money to himself. He would be miserable and the world be worse off because of it. For every Bill Gates there are many others like him who are not helping and go way past indulging in hobbies, living in luxury, and keeping wives and mistresses happy. This leads to unhappiness and the type of injustice Nareed was railing against.
May 9th, 2017 at 7:25:47 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 107
Posts: 11114
Quote: FrGamble
Notice you didn't say.


Notice I didn't say a lot of things.
Lets not stray from the point that
you were making, that money always
leads to misery. No it does NOT.

As I said and you ignored, I know
far far more happy people with
money than happy people without
it. What those with money are
doing to make them happy,
who cares. I know that those
without it are unhappy because
money relieves a lot of the stress
of day to day life. Which is not
a bad thing.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
May 9th, 2017 at 7:54:59 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 44
Posts: 5057
Quote: Evenbob
Notice I didn't say a lot of things.
Lets not stray from the point that
you were making, that money always
leads to misery. No it does NOT.


First all I did not say this. We were talking about riches and I define that as very upper class in the millions of dollars. That money spent all for oneself leads to misery for the person and the world.

Quote:
As I said and you ignored, I know
far far more happy people with
money than happy people without
it.


You seem to be talking about people in the middle class here with enough to do the things you mentioned earlier. I still hold that if they don't use some of their wealth to help those less fortunate they will become miserable and slaves to money.


Quote:

What those with money are
doing to make them happy,
who cares. I know that those
without it are unhappy because
money relieves a lot of the stress
of day to day life. Which is not
a bad thing.


We should all care what those who have loads of surplus money do with it. The misuse of money causes great misery to everyone. Those without money can be very happy as long as they have their basic needs met. Food, clothing, shelter, and some productive work. Still to this day some of the happiest people I ever met were in Zimbabwae. They had nothing in the form of money, but they had their faith, a community, and they worked together to provide for each other's needs.

Let me be clear money is not evil or a bad thing. It is the love of money that is the root of all evil. (that is probably an exaggeration but that is how the saying goes.)
May 9th, 2017 at 8:08:36 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 107
Posts: 11114
Quote: FrGamble
. That money spent all for oneself leads to misery for the person and the world.


Maybe, maybe not. You can't use axioms like
that as a wide brush to paint everybody with.
It's a case to case thing, everybody is different.


Quote:
I still hold that if they don't use some of their wealth to help those less fortunate they will become miserable and slaves to money.


Again, you are aflow with axioms on this. Hold
that all you like, religions are built on axioms.

Quote:
They had nothing in the form of money,


Good for them, go live there. We need money
to trade with, and to live. Like somebody once
said, money may not buy happiness but I'd
rather be crying in my Rolls than crying pushing
a shopping cart with all my belongings in it.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
May 10th, 2017 at 6:07:16 AM permalink
Nareed
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 318
Posts: 10831
Quote: FrGamble
It easy to say when


No, it's always easy to say.

Quote:
[..]when you see people wasting money and selfishly spend it on useless things when the above is true.


That might be hard to watch, but it doesn't make what I said any harder to say.

Quote:
Thank God for people like Bill Gates and some other very wealthy people who use their riches to serve the materially poor.


I support Gates and others who engage in charitable endeavors.

But the fact is he's already done the most he can possibly do in easing poverty, by helping drive down the price of computers and thus helping productivity at all levels. This increases everyone's wealth consistently and over a long period of time. Higher productivity is of more help to the poor than all charitable works put together.

BTW, Money can't buy happiness. But it gives you the ability to choose among a wide variety of miseries.

Also remember the words of that Jewish folk philosopher, Tevye of Anatevka: "Dear God, you made many, many poor people. I realize there's no shame in being poor, but it's no great honor either."
If Trump where half as smart as he thinks he is, he'd be twice as smart as he really is.
May 10th, 2017 at 12:44:43 PM permalink
Mosca
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 17
Posts: 393
A god would be a set that could contain itself.
May 10th, 2017 at 12:53:22 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 107
Posts: 11114
Quote: Mosca
A god would be a set that could contain itself.


God is mans invention, he can be anything
we say he is. Or isn't. What I never cease to
be astounded by is, gods colossal failure
at everything he's tasked with. Helping people
in distress, healing the sick, saving children,
answering prayers he promised to answer. Yet
people fail to notice, they plunge ahead like
god will come thru for them. If I had a lawn
mower that didn't start, I'd get a new one.
Common sense.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
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