Ken Burns' "Vietnam"

September 18th, 2017 at 7:22:26 PM permalink
Fleastiff
Member since: Oct 27, 2012
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Communism bleeds the poor.
Catholicism bleeds the poor.
Therefore Catholics tend to be anti communists.
September 18th, 2017 at 7:22:27 PM permalink
Fleastiff
Member since: Oct 27, 2012
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At Ap Bac seven APCs advanced on the tree line and shot at the clouds. They did it one at a time. Totally ineffective.
September 18th, 2017 at 11:18:43 PM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
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Finished the first episode. In general, best thing we ever did was getting the Hell out of there. Might not be the right decision in a different situation, but likely the best option there.

French had already produced a 100 years of bad karma. Seems like enough.
No one has ever proven I am not God.
September 19th, 2017 at 1:32:56 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
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I am really liking this documentary about Vietnam. I am very curious about what happened to Madame Nhu, the bad side of me hope her end was bad.

I think that second episode really brought out the sad reality that we backed the wrong government for far too long. Anyone could see that Diem was an evil tyrant. What he did to the Buddhists should have made this crystal clear. I now understand what those burning monks were all about, really sad and powerful stuff. Of course at this point in the story I don't know what we could have done, what a quagmire.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
September 19th, 2017 at 1:34:34 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
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Quote: Fleastiff
Communism bleeds the poor.
Catholicism bleeds the poor.
Therefore Catholics tend to be anti communists.


Crony and corrupt Catholicism bleeds the poor.

Catholics are anti communists for the same reason they are anti tyrants and corruption because it fails to treat every human person with the God given dignity they deserve.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
September 19th, 2017 at 1:43:29 PM permalink
terapined
Member since: Aug 6, 2014
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Quote: FrGamble
Crony and corrupt Catholicism bleeds the poor.

Catholics are anti communists for the same reason they are anti tyrants and corruption because it fails to treat every human person with the God given dignity they deserve.


That's an interesting take on this thread
Considering that according to the documentary
It was the French taking away dignity and communists getting it back for the their people by defeating the French
Sometimes we live no particular way but our own - Grateful Dead "Eyes of the World"
September 19th, 2017 at 2:01:44 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 56
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Oh believe me so far in this doc I seem to be fighting off a tendency to be rooting for the communists. They do seem to be restoring dignity to the people, but it is only a matter of time till the people discover that dignity is not a personal one but a communal one.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
September 19th, 2017 at 2:07:21 PM permalink
Nareed
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
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Quote: terapined
Considering that according to the documentary
It was the French taking away dignity and communists getting it back for the their people by defeating the French


Sagan's quote is always relevant to these topics:

"Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that, in glory and triumph, they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot."

The whole Vietnam debacle, from the French involvement to the fall of Saigon, was one big cluster f**k from start to finish. nevertheless, many critiques of Vietnam, in particular of the US portions of the war, tend to whitewash the many atrocities and the tyranny on the part of the other side in the conflict.
If Trump where half as smart as he thinks he is, he'd be twice as smart as he really is.
September 19th, 2017 at 2:13:45 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 56
Posts: 5779
Quote: Nareed
Sagan's quote is always relevant to these topics:

"Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that, in glory and triumph, they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot."

The whole Vietnam debacle, from the French involvement to the fall of Saigon, was one big cluster f**k from start to finish. nevertheless, many critiques of Vietnam, in particular of the US portions of the war, tend to whitewash the many atrocities and the tyranny on the part of the other side in the conflict.


+1
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
September 19th, 2017 at 2:40:38 PM permalink
Fleastiff
Member since: Oct 27, 2012
Threads: 53
Posts: 5743
One need only look at the numbers the communists killed or reeducated after their victory to consider human rights and dignity.

Remember LBJ... he wanted out of the war but he sure did not want to be the American President who lost it. He threw troops, whitewash and press releases to make sure someone else lost the war.