Will God Survive Science
February 26th, 2018 at 1:46:41 AM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
You overstate it, as usual. "As far as the Middle Ages are concerned, to what extent the Church limited or encouraged academic scientific thought and what, if any, the effects may have been, if we analyse the situation closely, we might find that 'creative tension' would be a more accurate picture of the relationship between science and religion." They didn't encourage or oppose it as much as they controlled it. The Church has always been about control. If science stayed within the guidelines, they didn't oppose it. Saying the Church was the greatest supporter of science is a misdirection of the truth. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
February 26th, 2018 at 5:48:01 AM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 | I'm just looking at the facts, but I can go with creative tension. Science after all has limits. Ethics and morality need to guide science. Also science sometimes need to be reminded that its realm is the observable and measurable. It cannot test or pronounce on the supernatural, nor make supernatural claims. Likewise religion at times needs to be reminded that what its role and realm is as well. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
February 26th, 2018 at 8:48:15 AM permalink | |
Dalex64 Member since: Mar 8, 2014 Threads: 3 Posts: 3687 | I suppose I can repeat the same claims over and over again too. Just because science has no explanation for certain events does not mean that a supernatural explanation is required or a supernatural explanation is the only possible explanation. Does God cause each and every curling stone to curl? There is no scientific explanation for why they do. There is also no reason to select one supernatural explanation over any other. That is why we have so many religions with mutually exclusive beliefs. Religion also therefore has no basis for testing or pronouncing on the supernatural, or making supernatural claims. "Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan |
February 26th, 2018 at 9:47:19 AM permalink | |
FrGamble Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 67 Posts: 7596 |
If there is no natural explanation then a supernatural explanation is required. In the case of all matter, energy, space, and time coming into existence a supernatural explanation is the only possible explanation. I feel this is self evident - a contingent thing cannot create itself or come from nothing.
Again I disagree. There are plenty of reasons to think an eternal, all-powerful, spiritual being is a better explanation that a giant supernatural turtle with the world on its back or a flying spaghetti monster. The reason there are so many religions has a lot to do with history, pride, culture, and sometimes an unwillingness to subject one's beliefs to science and reason.
I don't follow you here. Religion has a basis for testing and pronouncing on the supernatural and for making such claims. Some of it is based on revelation from the divine and as for testing and results one can look to the difference such things make in one's life for the better and the morals that under gird society. “It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” ( |
February 26th, 2018 at 10:41:26 AM permalink | |
Dalex64 Member since: Mar 8, 2014 Threads: 3 Posts: 3687 | Therefore God causes curling. "Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan |
February 26th, 2018 at 10:42:05 AM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
And you think creative tension is a good thing. It means, hey science, we the Church have our eye on you, better stay within the accepted guidelines or we'll crush you like a bug because we know everything. Science didn't flourish until the tension was relaxed and you didn't fell threatened if you pissed some Church nutcase off. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
February 26th, 2018 at 10:48:53 AM permalink | |
Evenbob Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 146 Posts: 25010 |
Yeah, no. That's the kind of ridiculous superstitious thinking that kept science in the dark ages for so long. The Church was absolutely incapable of saying they didn't know something because their egos were so severely swollen. So they made things up to fill in the gaps and proclaimed it the truth. The supernatural is always the last explanation on the list for anything. It's so far down the list that science will never get to it. Science will never get to the point where they throw up their arms and give up and blame what they can't figure out on some supernatural explanation. If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose. |
February 26th, 2018 at 10:50:11 AM permalink | |
Dalex64 Member since: Mar 8, 2014 Threads: 3 Posts: 3687 |
argument from ignorance
strawman
selecting an explanation that is desired does not make something true
circular logic "Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan |
February 26th, 2018 at 10:59:40 AM permalink | |
Nareed Member since: Oct 24, 2012 Threads: 346 Posts: 12545 |
Well, while there is no evidence of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, we do know that spaghetti, at least, does exist and is composed almost entirely of organic molecules. So it's more likely to exist than a "spiritual" being of uncertain composition. Donald Trump is a one-term LOSER |
February 26th, 2018 at 11:39:11 AM permalink | |
petroglyph Member since: Aug 3, 2014 Threads: 25 Posts: 6227 | If the church truly believed in their God, they would have no need for scientists. It has occurred to me, that the church employing scientists, amounts to what the church calls heresy. Does the bible not tell you all you need to know? If you trusted God, you wouldn't get vaccines. The last official act of any government is to loot the treasury. GW |