March for Life 2018

Quote: Face

since I don't view a clump of a couple, four, eight or a few thousand cells as "human", I see it as the correct choice,

Of course, that's the convenient attitude
to have when acting irresponsibly. A car
thief or a pick pocket or a mugger all
have convenient reasons for what they
do, it relieves them of having to examine
their actions closely and arriving at a
conclusion that isn't based on pure
selfishness. Doing that is way too much
work for a lot of people, it requires thinking
about your actions beforehand.

FrG rarely gives any ground on whatever he thinks has a firm Biblical foundation. Even if he can't fully explain why. At least that's been my impression.

Quote: rxwine

FrG rarely gives any ground on whatever he thinks has a firm Biblical foundation. Even if he can't fully explain why. At least that's been my impression.

When the Bible was written, women were property, education was two people (men) sitting either end of a log, children were cheap and necessary labor, abortion was unheard of, and birth control was non-existent.

If the bible is used as a refuge from modern times and abilities, it no longer serves those who seek its guidance.

Quote: Evenbob

Of course, that's the convenient attitude
to have when acting irresponsibly. A car
thief or a pick pocket or a mugger all
have convenient reasons for what they
do, it relieves them of having to examine
their actions closely and arriving at a
conclusion that isn't based on pure
selfishness. Doing that is way too much
work for a lot of people, it requires thinking
about your actions beforehand.

What's the alternative?

I come from trash (zero offense to my parents intended). I see this s#$% every day of my life, including within my own extended family. I've grown up with kids who have slept in mold (and I do mean "in", as in piles) during the night, shipped to school tired, malnourished and dirty during the day, and beaten in the afternoon. They're the same ones who in turn beat the s#$% out of anyone they could best as that's all they knew, damaging not only other innocent kids they targeted, but damaging the education and spirit of those around them. You ever see a dog bald and scabbed from mange, so lousy with jeets its skin seemed to roil? I know kids right now whose heads seem to sizzle with the amount of parasites in their hair. Remember you stating your heat never turned off all day, and ZOMG, it's -9*F outside? I know of 4 adults with 6 kids stuffed into what amounts to a treehouse; basically pole barn construction with a single sheet of 24yr old 7/16 plywood for a wall, and that's their "house".

I've no argument for your stance on responsibility. I share it. But if you think scooping some inanimate cells is a worse fate than what surrounds me in Rural America 2018, you live too charmed a life to understand. Or I lived too damaged a one. Abortions are tragic, but so is forcing someone to live in a situation that would make even Susan Sarandon shield her eyes.

There's a lot of blah blah blah in
this thread, I have yet to hear a
good argument that puts abortion
in any light other than dubious.

That's because it cannot ever be
put in a positive light, it's not a
positive action. The results might
get you what you want, and that's
what people concentrate on. Abortion
is the infamous 'ends do not justify
the means', and we all know it. We
all know it instinctively, don't we.

Quote: Face

I've no argument for your stance on responsibility. I share it. But if you think scooping some inanimate cells is a worse fate

So we get to determine fate when we
make decisions like this. Do you really
want to go down that road? History
is loaded with atrocious decisions
made for others because somebody
appointed themselves the decider of
their fates for their 'own good'.

All I want is for people so see abortion
for what it is and try to live their lives
accordingly. If you want to be responsible
for abortions than be responsible. Live
with it, deal with it, don't piss in my ear
tell me it's raining because you don't know
how to cope with the consequences of your
own decisions.

Quote: beachbumbabs

When the Bible was written, women were property, education was two people (men) sitting either end of a log, children were cheap and necessary labor, abortion was unheard of, and birth control was non-existent.



If the bible is used as a refuge from modern times and abilities, it no longer serves those who seek its guidance.

Perhaps I was too imprecise. There's the Bible, then there is the Catholic interpretation which probably encompasses 10 (100?) times the actual words in the Bible.

Quote: rxwine

Perhaps I was too imprecise. There's the Bible, then there is the Catholic interpretation which probably encompasses 10 (100?) times the actual words in the Bible.

Oh, at least 100 times. It used to be
the Catholic rule books regarding
sex were more voluminous than all
the other rule books put together.
The Church is absolutely obsessed
with the subject.

Quote: beachbumbabs

Birth control and sex education leads to dramatically lower abortion rates.

But we seem to be "educating" on the wrong things. Why don't we educate about what is going to happen if you have an illegitimate kid at a young age?

For females:

Your social life as you know it is over.
You will be in poverty pretty much all of your life.
Most of the better guys out there will have no interest in dating you.
Your life will be a repetitive series of 18 hour days for the next 15-20 years.

For men:

Say goodbye to 12%+ of your income, right off the top.
Should you not make this payment, be prepared to spend time in the county debtor's prison
You will probably be sued to pay for college for this child.


Instead, what is the message? Madonna sang about keeping her baby. Dan Quayle got ridiculed to no end. Left and right, the message is "YOU GO, GIRL!"

IMHO, these young girls need a "scared straight" program, as they more listen to pop culture than anything else.

I am pro-choice, anti-abortion as well. That means I believe abortion is murder, from conception. However, my beliefs mean nothing. We are in a society where we allow women (the mother), and the mother only, make a choice to end their unborn person's life and we champion this as "reproductive rights". We believe this is okay because we put much less value of the life in the womb then we do the life once it breathes on its own.

Scared straight programs are happening. I believe strongly in sexual education and contraception to stop unwanted children.

There are reasons of compassion that I would want abortions to be allowed: health of the mother; rape and incest; the health of the child. I don't support the social condition of the parent(s) for a reason to abort. There are plenty of successful people who start from very poor conditions.

Nonetheless I am male; it is none of my business.