Shutdown

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January 20th, 2018 at 6:31:14 AM permalink
Dalex64
Member since: Mar 8, 2014
Threads: 3
Posts: 3687
I am not sure if it was exactly the same thing as before, there are a couple of scenarios:

The party in the majority is completely unwilling to compromise
The party in the minority is completely unwilling to compromise

There are different reasons for them being unwilling to compromise such as
My way or the highway
Anything to cause the govt/administration to fail

What was the situation last time? What is it this time?
I know what I think, but my memory of the past might be inaccurate.

In the news in the last few days or hours there are reports of the Democrats attempting to compromise, or feeling like that they were close to a deal in order to approve another short or ultra short term funding in order to complete a deal.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan
January 20th, 2018 at 7:36:20 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: SOOPOO
Correct, because he has to deal with Democrats whose MAIN mission is to see Trump fail, NOT to serve the American people. If you put a lie detector on the Dems voting to shutdown, and asked them if making Trump look bad was their primary motive, it would be 100% yes. Not a one of them is doing this because it is good for American citizens. Some may be doing this because it is good for illegal aliens, though.


Democrats see that they won politically in past shutdowns so figure it will benefit them again. They are missing what seem to be 2 big points:

1. They are doing it for the benefit of illegal aliens. GOP needs to repeat that over, over, and over. Mr. and Mrs. America might claim to support DACA, but show some vets waiting for care and see what happens.

2. Trump will fight back. He does not play by the "rules" they back any other GOP pol into.

As to the anniversary of Trump in office, wasn't he supposed to have started a nuclear war by now? Liberals, it is you I am asking.
The President is a fink.
January 20th, 2018 at 8:08:13 AM permalink
ams288
Member since: Apr 21, 2016
Threads: 29
Posts: 12422
Quote: SOOPOO
Correct, because he has to deal with Democrats whose MAIN mission is to see Trump fail, NOT to serve the American people.


The GOP played this game for 8 years under Obama and I didn't hear any righties complaining then.

They're getting a taste of their own medicine...
“A straight man will not go for kids.” - AZDuffman
January 20th, 2018 at 8:52:40 AM permalink
SOOPOO
Member since: Feb 19, 2014
Threads: 22
Posts: 4157
Quote: ams288
The GOP played this game for 8 years under Obama and I didn't hear any righties complaining then.

They're getting a taste of their own medicine...


But lefties said how evil it was to do so. Of course, when it suits their goals, the main one being the downfall of Trump (and it does NOT matter to them if the country suffers), they will be evil too. And this shutdown is being done to protect illegal aliens, nothing more, nothing less. The American people will remember this when Congressman Joe Blow is running for re-election. He will win if he's from San Francisco, not so much if he's from Topeka.....
January 20th, 2018 at 9:15:49 AM permalink
terapined
Member since: Aug 6, 2014
Threads: 73
Posts: 11786
Quote: SOOPOO
But lefties said how evil it was to do so. Of course, when it suits their goals, the main one being the downfall of Trump (and it does NOT matter to them if the country suffers), they will be evil too. And this shutdown is being done to protect illegal aliens, nothing more, nothing less. The American people will remember this when Congressman Joe Blow is running for re-election. He will win if he's from San Francisco, not so much if he's from Topeka.....


What's your view on DACA
I have compassion
Do you?
I don't think the left is asking for much
Sometimes we live no particular way but our own - Grateful Dead "Eyes of the World"
January 20th, 2018 at 9:27:53 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: SOOPOO
But lefties said how evil it was to do so. Of course, when it suits their goals, the main one being the downfall of Trump (and it does NOT matter to them if the country suffers), they will be evil too. And this shutdown is being done to protect illegal aliens, nothing more, nothing less. The American people will remember this when Congressman Joe Blow is running for re-election. He will win if he's from San Francisco, not so much if he's from Topeka.....


The lefties invented the government shutdown under Reagan.
The President is a fink.
January 20th, 2018 at 9:35:38 AM permalink
SOOPOO
Member since: Feb 19, 2014
Threads: 22
Posts: 4157
Quote: terapined
What's your view on DACA
I have compassion
Do you?
I don't think the left is asking for much


Yikes.... a real toughie... In theory I would want the parents deported, as they were the ones that committed the crime, and their children should be sent with them to the country they were born in, and are citizens of. But I do understand the concept that these kids, or now even young adults, have only known living in America. But many families move from one country to another even though the kids 'have only known this country'. The only real reason most are for letting them stay is because the country they will be deported to is a 'shithhole' country. If they were gong to be deported to Norway this wouldn't even be news. Why is being deported to Mexico akin to being sent to jail?

I guess i dodged Ed's question. How about a ballot initiative and let the majority of citizens decide? I'd abide by what the majority of Americans want to do.
January 20th, 2018 at 9:40:13 AM permalink
SOOPOO
Member since: Feb 19, 2014
Threads: 22
Posts: 4157
Help me out here. I often hear that these illegal aliens are 'valuable, tax paying members of society'. I thought that federal income taxes are paid attached to a social security number. How do illegal aliens pay federal income taxes?
January 20th, 2018 at 10:15:54 AM permalink
Dalex64
Member since: Mar 8, 2014
Threads: 3
Posts: 3687
Federal income tax is just one tax. There are lots of others that illegal aliens end up paying.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan
January 20th, 2018 at 10:22:52 AM permalink
Face
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 61
Posts: 3941
Quote: SOOPOO
Yikes.... a real toughie... In theory I would want the parents deported, as they were the ones that committed the crime, and their children should be sent with them to the country they were born in, and are citizens of. But I do understand the concept that these kids, or now even young adults, have only known living in America. But many families move from one country to another even though the kids 'have only known this country'. The only real reason most are for letting them stay is because the country they will be deported to is a 'shithhole' country. If they were gong to be deported to Norway this wouldn't even be news. Why is being deported to Mexico akin to being sent to jail?


Devil's Advocate here...

My coup is gonna happen, so imagine if in 3-5 years, as you're shuffling all your retirement stuff in order, you suddenly found your home was now Indian Country. You have no say, no recourse. You simply hear some murmurs of something coming, then boom, a month or two later your house is no longer your house. You'd survive, I'm sure, but you could imagine there'd be quite a few irritants. A definite monkey wrench in your plans. A handful of months of stress. A dump truck's worth of #1stworldproblems.

Even though you'd still be American, even though you could move to Batavia or Pembroke or retire to the Outer Banks like you planned, it'd be f#$%ed up. It'd be quite the hassle and cost you a bunch of time, money, and possibly life plans, and all because someone with more power than you desired to impose his will upon you.

Now go back. You're not Dr. SOOP but Mr. SOOP, carrying a 3.6 in your sophomore year. Or maybe you just finished your Masters'. Or maybe just got your undergrad. Imagine NOW you're getting the boot. You don't even have to go to a s#$%hole, or even Mexico. You could go to Norway, sure. You could go to London. You could just walk down the block into Ontario, even. But just imagine you've spent 100% of your life living as an American, being an American, succeeding as an American, are about to produce as an American, and I come along with Trail of Tears v2.0. Is that just?

Just being DA in a thought experiment. I've little to no knowledge or concern with illegals; as you know, our biggest foreigner problem is Canadians leaving their old shoes in the Walden Galleria parking lot. But I'm not letting this idea of America being a "shining beacon" go, and this is not how you shine.
Be bold and risk defeat, or be cautious and encourage it.
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