Stockton UBI experiment

Quote: AZDuffman

I have been hearing the same dire employment predictions all my life. New jobs will replace the old. They always do.

Maybe. But all those horses who lost work pulling plows and carriages didn't get new jobs. Unless you mean the glue factory.

Quote: rxwine

Maybe. But all those horses who lost work pulling plows and carriages didn't get new jobs. Unless you mean the glue factory.

Lucky for them horses do not need an income.

On the other hand we started using robots in the 1960s yet we have tens of millions more people working now than then.

Looks like some positions came open: https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/hospital-suv-carrying-27-crashes-semitruck-killing-15-76205214

I would have liked to have seen an suv with 25 people in it just for chuckles. The wreck not so funny.

Quote: AZDuffman

I have been hearing the same dire employment predictions all my life. New jobs will replace the old. They always do.

Gotta agree. I think about jobs today that just didn't exist when I was a kid. Heck, even 'machine AP' was probably unheard of in the 60's. Internet security adviser? Computer chip manufacturer? Internet 'influencer'? Professional skateboarder? Anesthesiology assistant? Transgender studies professor? Cell phone repair technician? Etc.... Replaced 'dial phone' repair guy..... etc.....

Quote: SOOPOO

Gotta agree. I think about jobs today that just didn't exist when I was a kid. Heck, even 'machine AP' was probably unheard of in the 60's. Internet security adviser? Computer chip manufacturer? Internet 'influencer'? Professional skateboarder? Anesthesiology assistant? Transgender studies professor? Cell phone repair technician? Etc.... Replaced 'dial phone' repair guy..... etc.....

I agree and that's why I believe in open trade, no tariffs
If manufacturing jobs leave this country, they will be replaced. I was pretty shocked that Republicans have supported tariffs instead of free trade

Quote: terapined

I agree and that's why I believe in open trade, no tariffs
If manufacturing jobs leave this country, they will be replaced. I was pretty shocked that Republicans have supported tariffs instead of free trade

I'm no expert on tariffs. Don't really understand them. How we decide on which products, and how much? I generally am for 'free' anything, but aren't tariffs often in place to counter foreign governments from 'price fixing' to help their own companies at our companies' expense?

How do we have 'open trade' when we have to pay our 'low paid' workers $15 an hour when China can pay their workers $3 an hour? It is complicated....

Quote: SOOPOO

Same with any 'new program'. What other program will be eliminated or cut, or what taxes will be raised to pay for it?

In the case of a UBI, existing welfare programs would be gutted or eliminated as the UBI would serve as the welfare instead. I know that wouldn't pay for a UBI the full way, not even close. When I'm in charge, I'll raise energy and property taxes to make up the rest.

Quote: Wizard

In the case of a UBI, existing welfare programs would be gutted or eliminated as the UBI would serve as the welfare instead. I know that wouldn't pay for a UBI the full way, not even close. When I'm in charge, I'll raise energy and property taxes to make up the rest.

And how will people pay those taxes?

Quote: Wizard

In the case of a UBI, existing welfare programs would be gutted or eliminated as the UBI would serve as the welfare instead. I know that wouldn't pay for a UBI the full way, not even close. When I'm in charge, I'll raise energy and property taxes to make up the rest.

Hey math guy. Let's say UBI is $12k a year. I think that is a proposal that some have made? So say 300 million Americans qualify. I think that is 3.6 trillion dollars, right? Depending on you define a 'house', (82 million single family houses, but 139 million 'housing units'), (I'll use 125 million. So somewhere around $29k per household in added taxes. Subtract the 'savings' from lower welfare payments.... but I can't wait to hear when your property tax goes from $4k to $25k. You get the point.

Quote: SOOPOO

Hey math guy. Let's say UBI is $12k a year. I think that is a proposal that some have made? So say 300 million Americans qualify. I think that is 3.6 trillion dollars, right? Depending on you define a 'house', (82 million single family houses, but 139 million 'housing units'), (I'll use 125 million. So somewhere around $29k per household in added taxes. Subtract the 'savings' from lower welfare payments.... but I can't wait to hear when your property tax goes from $4k to $25k. You get the point.

Like I said, saying UBI will work is like saying you can get rid of dirt by digging a big hole and burying it. All the math in the world cannot change that fact.