Stockton UBI experiment

Quote: SOOPOO

Hey math guy. Let's say UBI is $12k a year. I think that is a proposal that some have made? So say 300 million Americans qualify. I think that is 3.6 trillion dollars, right? Depending on you define a 'house', (82 million single family houses, but 139 million 'housing units'), (I'll use 125 million. So somewhere around $29k per household in added taxes. Subtract the 'savings' from lower welfare payments.... but I can't wait to hear when your property tax goes from $4k to $25k. You get the point.

Don't you get back the 12k in the UBI yourself?

I think you do. The thing is, you'd probably just recycle it. But if your wealth went 100% south, you'd still get $1000 a month. Whereas otherwise you'd have to jump through all the welfare loops

A boring, pedantic point re: the advice the CPA gave Petroglyph, but gross income, not whether you owe, determines the filing requirement.

Of course I know nothing about the specific tax situation. The CPA' s advice may work best.

Though it could get dicey in a year or two if the IRS notices significant 2020 income and wonders why they received no tax return.

Quote: Altstates93

A boring, pedantic point re: the advice the CPA gave Petroglyph, but gross income, not whether you owe, determines the filing requirement.

Of course I know nothing about the specific tax situation. The CPA' s advice may work best.

Though it could get dicey in a year or two if the IRS notices significant 2020 income and wonders why they received no tax return.

I will file, I overpaid, just not sure when, I think maybe it is some AP move about whether or not we receive "stimmy checks"?

That or she could already be dazed and confused from the amount of returns she has already done.

Quote: gamerfreak

As Gandler already mentioned, I think all, or nearly all, assistance ‘programs’ should be replaced with UBI.

If nothing else, it would at least be more efficient.

Quote: Altstates93

A boring, pedantic point re: the advice the CPA gave Petroglyph, but gross income, not whether you owe, determines the filing requirement.

Of course I know nothing about the specific tax situation. The CPA' s advice may work best.

Though it could get dicey in a year or two if the IRS notices significant 2020 income and wonders why they received no tax return.

I see this blogger/finance writer came up with the same strategy; https://www.thestreet.com/mishtalk/economics/how-to-game-the-system-and-legally-get-more-money-than-you-are-entitled

Quote: petroglyph

I see this blogger/finance writer came up with the same strategy; https://www.thestreet.com/mishtalk/economics/how-to-game-the-system-and-legally-get-more-money-than-you-are-entitled

Affirmed: Your CPA's advice worked best.

Also affirmed: I made a boring, pedantic point.

My 2019 income exceeded the stimulus threshold, but my 2020 income bubbled underneath it. In my situation filing my 2020 tax return early, rather than delaying, worked best for me.

Last year the opposite approach worked best. Like 2020, my 2018 income fell just below the threshold. So I delayed filing the 2019 return so they would base that stimulus on 2018.

I can imagine scenarios whereby people nowhere near eligibility this year could become eligible several years from now through amending their 2020 return. Though that would involve more boring pedantry, or anti-stimulus if you will.

Quote: Altstates93

Affirmed: Your CPA's advice worked best.

Also affirmed: I made a boring, pedantic point.

I didn't think so.

Quote:

My 2019 income exceeded the stimulus threshold, but my 2020 income bubbled underneath it. In my situation filing my 2020 tax return early, rather than delaying, worked best for me.

Last year the opposite approach worked best. Like 2020, my 2018 income fell just below the threshold. So I delayed filing the 2019 return so they would base that stimulus on 2018.

I can imagine scenarios whereby people nowhere near eligibility this year could become eligible several years from now through amending their 2020 return. Though that would involve more boring pedantry, or anti-stimulus if you will.

I didn't know this was going to happen with the bonus round, it will be the only time I will come close. I cashed in an annuity.

Quote: SOOPOO

Hey math guy. Let's say UBI is $12k a year. I think that is a proposal that some have made? So say 300 million Americans qualify. I think that is 3.6 trillion dollars, right? Depending on you define a 'house', (82 million single family houses, but 139 million 'housing units'), (I'll use 125 million. So somewhere around $29k per household in added taxes. Subtract the 'savings' from lower welfare payments.... but I can't wait to hear when your property tax goes from $4k to $25k. You get the point.

I don't claim to be the average person, but my goal would be that the average person would roughly break even. If I pay more than I get, then so be it. I'd like to think that with people no longer incentivized to not work, then the entire economy will be stronger with more good and services created and we'll all benefit from that.

Quote: SOOPOO

Hey math guy. Let's say UBI is $12k a year. I think that is a proposal that some have made? So say 300 million Americans qualify. I think that is 3.6 trillion dollars, right? Depending on you define a 'house', (82 million single family houses, but 139 million 'housing units'), (I'll use 125 million. So somewhere around $29k per household in added taxes. Subtract the 'savings' from lower welfare payments.... but I can't wait to hear when your property tax goes from $4k to $25k. You get the point.

Why would a Federal program influence property taxes?

Property taxes are (basically) exclusively a city or county government tax, this is not something that UBI would (on even the most extreme anti-UBI examples) influence at all.... I fail to see any argument that UBI would effect local millage rates.....

If anything UBI may (this is pure speculation) lower property taxes in some cities because UBI would allow local governments to save money from giving programs for people that were in need before... UBI would certainly increase Federal taxes, but it would not have a negative effect on local taxes...... (some speculative arguments could be made that it could even lower them....) But jumping from "4k to 25k" a year for property taxes, that is pure fear-mongering that is not founded on any basis......