Good Friday

Page 9 of 10« First<678910>
April 2nd, 2018 at 11:30:31 AM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
This emotion didn't evolve nor does the things we feel guilty about.


Of course they evolved, that's where
they came from. In the so called
Dark Ages in England, cannibalism
was a common practice in the rural
areas. If you were a stranger wandering
thru some clans territory, you might
end up on the dinner table.

These people felt no guilt or remorse
in eating you, they were taught their
clan was unique and outsiders that
were not part of it had no rights and were
fair game for robbery or dinner.

This way of thinking followed them to
the New World and it was common even
in the 19th century for clans living in
the back hills in the rural South to have
their own rules, and woe be to you if
you entered their territory. They would
feel zero guilt about killing you on the
spot and stealing all you had.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
April 2nd, 2018 at 1:28:20 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
You can be taught these immoral things all you want and pretend circumstances excuse but none of it works. You feel guilt each and every time and you have to more and more suppress it or pretend it doesn't exist. This is obvious because even in these periods no body is proud of their cannibalism or how dastardly they treated visitors. You also have to dehumanize people in order for you to not feel guilt. You'll notice this phenomenon in any culture that includes human sacrifice or enslavement. Great efforts are made to hide and silence the humanity of those who are mistreated. The smallest show of the humanity of the victim will cause the whole structure to come tumbling down, which it always will eventually. You can't do what is morally wrong for too long before it destroys people and civilization. Guilt, even suppressed and hidden will always manifest itself.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
April 2nd, 2018 at 2:04:07 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
You can be taught these immoral things all you want and pretend circumstances excuse but none of it works.


In fact it always works, until a different
part of society comes along and teaches
you something different. Guilt is a learned
response, you aren't born with it.

You've obviously never raised a baby
into a small child. You have to teach
them manners, you have to teach them
when to feel guilt. They'll abuse the cat
or another child and think it's funny.
As a parent you constantly have to be
after them to learn how to be a correct
civilized little human because they have
no idea otherwise. We aren't born with
a built in guilt response, quite the opposite.
We're born being totally selfish, and you
can see it easily in kids who have bad
parents.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
April 2nd, 2018 at 3:28:58 PM permalink
Fleastiff
Member since: Oct 27, 2012
Threads: 62
Posts: 7831
Quote: Evenbob
Dark Ages in England, cannibalism was a common practice in the rural areas. .
I'm not sure of that. Its rather unhealthy to consume pathogens from one's own species. Evidence of nicked bones is subject to interpretation.
April 2nd, 2018 at 3:33:00 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
Quote: Evenbob
They'll abuse the cat
or another child and think it's funny.


Until it cries out or bleeds and then you can see the change.

Once the cat is seen as an animal that feels pain, once the baby cries out and forces them to see its shared humanity; they will feel the guilt. It is built in and it has to be beaten and brainwashed out of us. Even then it is too strong and trying to suppress the emotion and making someone inhuman will eventually destroy them.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
April 2nd, 2018 at 3:38:52 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
Until it cries out or bleeds and then you can see the change. .


Maybe, maybe not. There are all
kinds of people that didn't figure
it out or weren't taught it. Because it's
not an instinct, sharing and not
hurting almost always have to be
taught to young kids. It's a constant
thing, telling them to play fair and
be nice. By nature they want to
be selfish, it's self preservation.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
April 2nd, 2018 at 4:21:43 PM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
It sounds like you are conflating not sharing with torturing a cat or a baby. However, the same natural born-in instinct will arise in any child. They will share once they see the hurt they are causing to another human being who is just like them. Bob, the reality is you can't get around the truth that we all feel guilt naturally when we hurt others.

For example, I can guarantee you that if you and I were having this conversation over a beer we would be so much nicer to each other and so friendly that those reading the transcript would refuse to believe it was the same two people. Over the internet forum where our faces, names, emotions, and person hood are hidden we can both say things that we would never in a million years say to each other's faces.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
April 2nd, 2018 at 5:26:32 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: FrGamble
They will share once they see.


They will share once it's pointed
out to them over and over by
a patient parent. Or if they have
a bad parent, they will always
be selfish and self centered, a
classic 'spoiled brat'. Surely you
saw these kids in school, out of
control, bullies sometimes. All they
see is themselves in every situation
because they were never taught any
different.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
April 3rd, 2018 at 5:32:08 AM permalink
FrGamble
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 67
Posts: 7596
First of all everything you are saying about the inherent selfishness of children is evidence of original sin. The point I disagree with you about is the depth of the problem. I don't believe kids are through and through selfish monsters. I have seen far too much spontaneous kindness even in the "spoiled brats from bad families" as you call them. Kids like any of us are wounded and we need help to be the good people we were made an who we desire to be. I maintain that seeing another's humanity and equality is the key because we innately feel guilty when we hurt another person.
“It is with the smallest brushes that the artist paints the most exquisitely beautiful pictures.” (
April 3rd, 2018 at 10:34:15 AM permalink
Dalex64
Member since: Mar 8, 2014
Threads: 3
Posts: 3687
It is evidence that people are not born with instinctive knowledge of what kind of behavior is acceptable to the society into which they were born and therefore need to be taught.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan
Page 9 of 10« First<678910>