Black Gold, Texas Tea

I posed this question to AZD via PM, but figure it’ll get more exposure and I might get more answers if I post here (especially since Paco frequents this forum =))

I’ve begun to look for acreage and one of the few places being considered is in the Olean / Allegany / Bradford area. There are a lot of oil / gas wells in these parts and just about every property contains something.

My question is about mineral / gas rights. Some properties have no rights, just maybe your own personal use gas well (free heating). Other’s have rights which are claimed, but will go to the new owner (me) upon death of the claim holder (the holder in question is 92). Other’s have rights which aren’t included, but can be included for an extra cost. And still others throw the rights in with cost of property.

My question is how much weight to give these rights. We’re not looking at this as a way to become the next Jed Clampett; the purpose of the property is purely housing / recreation. We’re looking for somewhere to put a house and have ATV trails, fishing pond, and hunting grounds that are ours. But this “rights” deal is beyond my knowledge.

So how much weight should they be given? Is it something that’s just “nice”, could take it or leave it? Or would it be worth giving it some serious consideration as the benefits could be large?

In case it matters, the plot size we’re focusing on is at least 30 acres but no more than 100.

A LOT,

They can drill almost anywere on the land to get to the mineral. If privecy is important own them your self.

Quote: whatme

A LOT,

They can drill almost anywere on the land to get to the mineral. If privecy is important own them your self.

Perhaps I should add that this area has been gas welled to death for decades. All properties, and I mean all, already have wells drilled and access roads blazed. If the rights owner uses them, it’s kind of no big deal to me.

But if you’re saying I could risk them raping new trails through my woods and drilling a well in my back yard, then that's a problem. Is that what you're saying?

Quote: Face

But if you’re saying I could risk them raping new trails through my woods and drilling a well in my back yard, then that's a problem. Is that what you're saying?

YES thats what I'm saying.

Keep in mind they got out the cheap stuff but as prices rise they will go for the rest.

Quote: whatme

YES thats what I'm saying.

Keep in mind they got out the cheap stuff but as prices rise they will go for the rest.

Jeezis! I thought this was just a financial decision. That sounds like madness...

Quote: Face

I could risk them raping new trails through my woods and drilling a well in my back yard, then that's a problem.

They can put the wells almost anywhere and the roads almost anywhere as well as any required equipment... and if that just happens to be right outside your front door or in your swimming pool ... too bad for you. Get the mineral rights... and remember sand is the mineral mica. Don't think of only oil and gas, just because that is what everybody else is currently thinking.

Quote: Fleastiff

They can put the wells almost anywhere and the roads almost anywhere as well as any required equipment... and if that just happens to be right outside your front door or in your swimming pool ... too bad for you. Get the mineral rights... and remember sand is the mineral mica. Don't think of only oil and gas, just because that is what everybody else is currently thinking.

Ha! Yeah, I suppose having a floating oil rig in my bass pond would sort of throw off the vibe I was going for XD

I know I said it already, but this just sounds like madness. I had no idea that this was a possibility. AZD said he’d pop in with more info, but for now it sounds like this isn’t a decision at all. Sounds more like a demand, at least if I want “my” land to be “mine”. Like I said, I’m familiar with Tex-Key or NYSEG coming to friend’s / family’s land with their convoy of ATVs and heading into “their” woods on established trails to established wells, and that’s no big deal. But blazing / blasting more? Nah.

Quote: Face

established trails to established wells, and that’s no big deal.

Did they make the trails in the first place?

They will do whats cheaper if thers a trail why waist $ on a new one?

Need a trail make one.

I would want to own the rights so I could controll what happens.

Quote: whatme

Did they make the trails in the first place?

They will do whats cheaper if thers a trail why waist $ on a new one?

They did. As I said, this area has been oil/gas mined since before I was born. There are established access trails and established wells everywhere already (and I mean everywhere). That led me to believe the only "disturbance" I'd suffer is having the Co.'s show up with a brigade of ATVs to do work on them, which I wouldn't find disturbing at all, and that this was purely a financial decision, basically, "do I want the profits for myself?".

Maybe the amount of trails / wells is a key piece of info. I've known of trails / wells in numbers of places all my life. I can’t recall a single place that has had new trails blazed or new wells dug (going back 20 years) because there are already so many. But then again, it seems this industry is picking up the pace, so if we’re talking the next 50 years…

I suppose AZ will be able to answer a lot of this…

Quote: Face

and heading into “their” woods on established trails to established wells, and that’s no big deal. But blazing / blasting more? Nah.

Its not just blazing more trails but erecting a warehouse or pumping station if they decide they need it. Also look at the changing nature of exploiting mineral rights.

Deeds that referred to "logging rights" used to mean going in with a team of horses and taking a select few trees here and there. Now those deeds have been held to embrace going in with massive machinery and clear cutting wide swaths of land. As the techniques of exploiting minerals have changed, so has the extend of the practices permitted.

Its a bit like the Japanese truck farmers in California. No one would lease land to them so they leased from the utility company and accepted the risks that utility trucks might drive over their crops. Then the war broke out and they were accused of plotting to blow up the utility transmission lines. The interpretations of lease restrictions are often made with malice as times change.