Movie business and billionaire

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January 29th, 2014 at 11:06:45 PM permalink
Fleastiff
Member since: Oct 27, 2012
Threads: 62
Posts: 7831
Quote: Pacomartin
Carmike Theaters gets ($6.85+$3.91)*60 patrons= $645.60 per movie theater day. Now typically you show a movie four times per day at 1:00 4:30 7:00 9:30.
Even with some limited start and pause control by the patrons you could probably get five rentals per day. Concession sales could still be possible.
. Social networking sites could be encouraged to assemble groups of 8 people who want to see a particular film.
Often there are additional and perhaps unaudited showings.

What you are suggesting is similar to marketing fine wines via a wine bar wherein a certain number of drinkers have to buy glasses before the bottle is opened.

So instead of people in a community being brought together by an interest in fine wines, people in the community are being brought together by a Film Promoter or Cinema Club. Its possible but I think watching a movie is not likely to be quite as marketable, particularly when the quality of offerings is perhaps illusory.
January 30th, 2014 at 3:50:39 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: Pacomartin

I have always wondered if you could rent an 8 seat micro theater for and average of $80 with an 85" television screen. People could rent the theater for a given time with their discretion of how many people they want to go in with. Even with some limited start and pause control by the patrons you could probably get five rentals per day. Concession sales could still be possible.


The problem I see is that there is little incentive over just releasing it to homes for the same price. 85" isn't that much bigger of a screen and to be honest such a small group would to me feel like my B-52 was shot down over China and they are making us watch propaganda films. (or just MSNBC) The kids today might go for it, but I'm not so sure.

The revenue split is split is still the issue. The cinema owner gives nearly all of the box office to the studio. So you have concessions to make your profit. The price points there have gotten to where more and more people refuse to pay.

The local movie house has to change. We might need to change the laws to again let studios own them. This would mean a few concentrated with studio ownership and lots of smaller houses showing indie films. Personally I think the model cannot really be fixed and the owners might be best to ride a declining market out to the end, investing little in the facilities and just wait for what the solution will be.
The President is a fink.
January 30th, 2014 at 5:56:41 AM permalink
boymimbo
Member since: Mar 25, 2013
Threads: 5
Posts: 732
That's not true. Take Regal.

Its revenue from admissions was 1,925.1 million in 2012. The film rental and advertising costs was 1,000.5 million which is a margin of over 90%. So just over 1/2 of the admission price goes to the box office. So, for that $8.90 avergage ticket price, $4.40 of that goes to the theater, the upkeep, the staff, etc.

Now, for "local" movie houses, it's a bit different. They don't get first run movies. Attendances are generally low. If the model was to change, it would be to allow the "local" movie houses to show first run movies.

The true problem for local movie houses is convenience and comfort. They don't have large parking lots. They often don't have restaurants nearby. They don't have indoor waiting areas. Their seats usually need refurbishment. The screens can be smaller. But if you do a local movie house right, it can be highly successful. But that takes a high degree of initial commitment and capital from the ownership.

What happened is that the old movie houses which were wildly successful before the multiplexes got swept away when the multiplexes opened. They lost their first run films and were forced to cope with the changing market conditions. Those that stayed open did so on razor thin profits or even losses and they could not afford to update their concessions or their theatres. And there was pressure to sell as these theatres were frequently in high-value commercial areas. So theatres that remained became run down or were sold. Few remain.

I think all of us who are old enough (over 40) have very fond memories of these local theatres.
January 30th, 2014 at 12:51:26 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: boymimbo
That's not true. Take Regal.

Its revenue from admissions was 1,925.1 million in 2012. The film rental and advertising costs was 1,000.5 million which is a margin of over 90%. So just over 1/2 of the admission price goes to the box office. So, for that $8.90 avergage ticket price, $4.40 of that goes to the theater, the upkeep, the staff, etc.



90% margin?? Looks like closer to 50% gross to me. Where does the 90% come from?
The President is a fink.
January 30th, 2014 at 10:39:59 PM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: Pacomartin
Carmike Theaters gets ($6.85+$3.91)*60 patrons= $645.60 per movie theater day. Now typically you show a movie four times per day at 1:00 4:30 7:00 9:30.



For Carmike $6.85*60 patrons= $411 box office per theater per day of which roughly half ($206) goes to the movie distribution company. Now Carmike as the 4th largest chain in the country gets less revenue than the larger chains like Regal and AMC. Carmike targets smaller cities. Now $206 does not seem like a lot of money for four showings of a movie.

So films often bypass theaters completely and go straight to DVD and Pay per View. Lovelace was a good example of a film with a fairly prominent cast of young actors. Mel Gibson's "Get the Gringo" went to DirecTV for a limited one month exclusive engagement.


But cinema chains have been pretty defensive about permitting a film to come out on pay per view within 90 days of a theater release. Most large films are released on DVD and Pay per view 6 months after the theater release, but trashy horror-porn and ethnic comedies are released even sooner. But when a big name film with Eddie Murphy and Ben Stiller was going to be released on PPV in 8 weeks, the chains said they would boycott the film. The plans were shelved.

The micro theater would fill a gap. It would permit privacy for a group of friends. It could be located in office buildings for a group of adults that might want to play hookey from work for 90 minutes, but wouldn't dream of driving over to the local cineplex.

Prima Cinema is selling first run films for $500-$600 per film, plus you must buy $35K in equipment so that the films are not bootlegged. Films like "Vampire Academy" are offered. So it seems as if people might be willing to spend $80 to rent a micro-theater with 8 seats to see a first run film.
January 31st, 2014 at 3:47:11 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: Pacomartin


Prima Cinema is selling first run films for $500-$600 per film, plus you must buy $35K in equipment so that the films are not bootlegged. Films like "Vampire Academy" are offered. So it seems as if people might be willing to spend $80 to rent a micro-theater with 8 seats to see a first run film.


To see what is going to happen to movies I feel we need only look at what has happened to TV, music, and soon radio.

In 1980 TV was 3 networks plus PBS plus some local stations where you could watch professional wrestling in prime time. By 1985 it was already falling apart and 25 years later you have 100 channels but more and more people pulling the plug because they can just pick and choose micro-formats on outlets from Netflix to Youtube.

In 1988 music was booming with the combination of new acts for the kids and older folks rebuilding their collections with CDs. Paying $17 for mostly three songs they liked, that is probably $30 today. 15 years later songs would be sold for $1 if you paid at all and record stores were a thing of the past, except for ones selling used CDs and vinyl. Like TV, specialization was what happened.

Radio is just starting to crack. You can listen to SIRI, HD radio, or even podcasts again by indies some of whom are pretty darn good. Less commercials and you always get to hear a subject you like. Like TV and music, specialization and personalization are what happened.

So we have movies, and we have more than ever the model of the big budget blockbuster in the chains. I don't buy the 8-seat idea as most living rooms are that size of far more. But due to the above I see more and more mega-plexes closing. I see where there will be room for 1-2 "blockbusters" a month at fewer chains and more direct to video. I see most movies being made for <$5MM and even more indie micro-budget films.

People still need a place for date nights or just to get out, but more and more would rather stay home.
The President is a fink.
January 31st, 2014 at 12:15:50 PM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: AZDuffman
People still need a place for date nights or just to get out, but more and more would rather stay home.


Yes, of course a movie is still a pretty inexpensive place to take a date. High school kids would still rather go anywhere even if there home system is a 12 screen with ultra ultra high definition. Which is why most blockbusters today are firmly aimed at the 17 year old boy.

Article on Prima's system which is $35K plus $500 or $600 per movie rental (24 hours).

Quote: LA Times
"There are thousands of people out there, if not tens of thousands of people, that could buy this product," Pang said. "We found the secret sauce to make billionaires act like little giddy schoolchildren." A survey of 1,000 U.S. home builders found that 29% of residences they built in 2011 included home theaters, up from 20% a year earlier, according to market research firm Parks Associates.
So far, Prima has deals with Universal Pictures and independents Magnolia Pictures and Cinedigm. It also offers movies from Universal's Focus Features division and is said to be in talks with Lionsgate to carry the company's films.



It just seems like there must be market between the high school kids, and the people who have hundreds of thousands to shell out to build a home theater system plus $500 per film. These people want to rent a miniature screening room and watch a first run movie, either with a group of friends or by themselves. I would think micro theaters would do very well in Vegas resorts.


As Mel Gibson showed us with the "Passion of Christ" you can become ultra rich by targeting an audience that generally regards going to a movies as a sin, or at least not an option. The Hunger Games: Catching Fire sold roughly 50 million tickets in US and Canada to be this year's biggest film. But USA and Canada have a population of almost 350 million people.
February 1st, 2014 at 5:28:56 AM permalink
Fleastiff
Member since: Oct 27, 2012
Threads: 62
Posts: 7831
Yes, movie theaters fill a niche but one that is less and less significant.

Movies aimed at 17 year old males? Maybe but most seem to prefer a night in a vampire bar than going to a movie theater where they have to behave themselves.

Theaters exist but restaurants and sports bars and hotels surround them.

Dying? Last Picture Show was a movie of long ago. Soon it will be a reality or atleast The Last Good Picture Show will be a reality.

Or maybe five years at a rendering farm will produce a heroin needle puncturing a young girl's arm in some new style and we will all flock to see junkies and vampires and voodoo cults in suburbia.
February 1st, 2014 at 8:10:40 AM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: Fleastiff
Yes, movie theaters fill a niche but one that is less and less significant.


If you look at the Best Picture nominations and their position in rank of highest earnings for the year, it seems as if their should be some sort of market for adults who can't afford 8 foot television screens but who want a civilized night out. Micro theaters could be placed in hotels, resorts and apartment complexes.

If there is a market for $500 or $600 for first screen films in the home, there should be a market for people who want to rent an 8 seat theater.

1 The Hunger Games: Catching Fire
2 Iron Man 3
3 Despicable Me 2
4 Frozen
5 Man of Steel
6 Monsters University
7 Gravity
8 The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug
9 Fast & Furious 6
10 Oz The Great and Powerful
11 Star Trek Into Darkness
12 Thor: The Dark World
13 World War Z
14 The Croods
15 The Heat
16 We're the Millers
17 The Great Gatsby (2013)
18 The Conjuring
19 Identity Thief
20 Grown Ups 2
21 The Wolverine
22 American Hustle
23 Anchorman 2: The Legend Continues
24 G.I. Joe: Retaliation
25 Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs 2
26 Now You See Me
27 Lee Daniels' The Butler
28 The Hangover Part III
29 Epic
30 Captain Phillips
31 Jackass Presents: Bad Grandpa
32 Pacific Rim
33 This is the End
34 The Wolf of Wall Street
35 Olympus Has Fallen
36 Lone Survivor
37 42
38 Elysium
39 Planes
40 The Lone Ranger
41 Oblivion
42 Insidious Chapter 2
43 Turbo
44 Saving Mr. Banks
45 2 Guns
46 White House Down
47 Mama
48 Safe Haven
49 The Smurfs 2
50 The Best Man Holiday
51 Percy Jackson: Sea of Monsters
52 A Good Day to Die Hard
53 Warm Bodies
54 Jack the Giant Slayer
55 The Purge
56 Last Vegas
57 Ender's Game
58 Prisoners
59 After Earth
60 Escape From Planet Earth
61 The Secret Life of Walter Mitty
62 Hansel and Gretel: Witch Hunters
63 Free Birds
64 Evil Dead (2013)
65 Red 2
66 Tyler Perry's A Madea Christmas
67 Tyler Perry's Temptation: Confessions of a Marriage Counselor
68 The Call
69 Pain and Gain
70 Gangster Squad
71 Jurassic Park 3D
72 The Internship
73 Instructions Not Included
74 12 Years a Slave
75 Snitch
76 Riddick
77 A Haunted House
78 47 Ronin
79 The Family (2013)
80 Carrie (2013)
81 Walking with Dinosaurs
82 Texas Chainsaw 3D
83 R.I.P.D.
84 Blue Jasmine
85 Kevin Hart: Let Me Explain
86 Side Effects (2013)
87 Scary Movie 5
88 The Mortal Instruments: City of Bones
89 Delivery Man
90 Grudge Match
91 One Direction: This is Us
92 Kick-Ass 2
93 August: Osage County
94 Rush (2013)
95 The Host (2013)
96 Philomena
97 The World's End
98 21 and Over
99 Escape Plan
100 Don Jon
101 The Incredible Burt Wonderstone
102 The Big Wedding
103 Mud
104 Baggage Claim
105 The Way, Way Back
106 The Place Beyond the Pines
107 Dallas Buyers Club
108 The Book Thief
109 Homefront
110 Her (2013)
111 Broken City
112 Beautiful Creatures (2013)
113 Runner Runner
114 You're Next
115 Quartet
116 Admission
117 Parker
118 Enough Said
119 Dark Skies
120 The Counselor
121 Jobs
122 Fruitvale Station
123 About Time
124 The Last Exorcism Part II
125 Spring Breakers
126 Nebraska
April 21st, 2014 at 12:41:41 PM permalink
Fleastiff
Member since: Oct 27, 2012
Threads: 62
Posts: 7831
For a new way to price films:

From Slashdot:
Popular director Joss Whedon has taken the film world by surprise by releasing his latest offering, 'In Your Eyes', available for download on the same day it premiered at the Tribeca Film Festival. The new release comes from Whedon's own "micro studio", Bellwether Pictures, and is featured on Vimeo as a $5 rental, (free trailer). Whedon mused, 'It's exciting for us because we get to explore yet another new form of distribution — and we get $5.' Mr. Whedon has a history of pushing the delivery envelope, as with Dr. Horrible's Sing-Along Blog, in 2008."
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