Original Sin?

Quote: FrGamble

I think this is another thing Christianity frees us from.

How in light of the history of your own church can you possibly come to this conclusion?

While today we'd call extremist someone who insisted misfortune is divine punishment, such views were as common in "Christendom" clear through the Renaissance (literally!!) The leading Christian empire, the Byzantines, devoted much argument, conflict and civil war to the question of whether iconophiles or iconoclasts were bringing down god's wrath upon them.

Quote: FrGamble

If you were in court to prove that there is no God what would be your opening statement?

It's a non issue. There is as much evidence
that god exists as there is for Superman,
Santa, Unicorns, and Thor existing. There's
no starting point for an argument because
none of these concepts have ever been
seen in real life.

Quote:

Have you ever thought about what someone else would say to you but heard it in your own voice or in your own mind? Is this not real?

Loony bins are full of people who think
everybody from Elvis to Teddy Roosevelt
is speaking to them. Hearing voices in
your mind is the most common type of
hallucination in people with psychotic
disorders such as schizophrenia. I don't
think you're making the compelling case
you think you are..

Quote: Evenbob

It's a non issue. There is as much evidence
that god exists as there is for Superman,
Santa, Unicorns, and Thor existing. There's
no starting point for an argument because
none of these concepts have ever been
seen in real life.

If you don't mind me saying so that opening statement is not very convincing. When are you going to use evidence or present a coherent logical argument as to why God most certainly does not exist? I'm waiting.

Quote:

Loony bins are full of people who think
everybody from Elvis to Teddy Roosevelt
is speaking to them. Hearing voices in
your mind is the most common type of
hallucination in people with psychotic
disorders such as schizophrenia. I don't
think you're making the compelling case
you think you are..

Didn't you just complain bitterly about think pew was twisting people's words. Either your reading comprehension is way off or you simply have such disdain for me and my position that you think I was saying that prayer is equivalent to speaking to Elvis. As I've told stinkingliberal before - if you need your strawmen arguments to hold your position you need to rethink your position.

What exactly is your objection to prayer and having a real relationship with God?

Quote: Nareed

How in light of the history of your own church can you possibly come to this conclusion?

While today we'd call extremist someone who insisted misfortune is divine punishment, such views were as common in "Christendom" clear through the Renaissance (literally!!) The leading Christian empire, the Byzantines, devoted much argument, conflict and civil war to the question of whether iconophiles or iconoclasts were bringing down god's wrath upon them.

Mostly by ignoring history. I should say I ignore those constant attempts even in Christendom to fall back into the slavery of thinking we have to earn salvation and that God punishes us for our sins - all of these ideas break upon the bulwark of Christ and His death and resurrection (aka The Gospel).

Quote: FrGamble

that you think I was saying that prayer is equivalent to speaking to Elvis.

At least Elvis was real, I would believe
that before I believed you were
spraking to a god.

Quote:

What exactly is your objection to prayer and having a real relationship with God?

For you? It's fine, whatever floats your
boat. For me it's going way too far
into fantasy land, I have better things
to waste my time on.

Quote: FrGamble

Mostly by ignoring history. I should say I ignore those constant attempts even in Christendom to fall back into the slavery of thinking we have to earn salvation and that God punishes us for our sins - all of these ideas break upon the bulwark of Christ and His death and resurrection (aka The Gospel).

Going by what you say and how other people behave, I must ask: How does it feel to be the world's only real Christian?

Quote: Nareed

Going by what you say and how other people behave, I must ask: How does it feel to be the world's only real Christian?

I'm still waiting for Pew to explain how
heaven and hell are not the cornerstones
of the religion.

The brain power and knowledge the people in these forums exhibit far exceeds mine so for the most part I
just sit back and let you folks educate me.

That being said I would like to point out to Father G. in this world the burden of proof falls upon the one making
the claim. In a court of law the burden would be yours to prove your god exists (your making the claim).
Evenbob need not or has not anything to prove.

You are correct rainman and too humble. This is where the analogy to a courtroom kindof breaks down. We are both claiming something we think to be true. I am saying there is a God and he is saying there is not. A nuetral position of just sitting back and looking for evidence not sure one way or the other does not and really cannot bear any burden of proof. It is when one of us has the audacity to say we are right that you do take on the burden to show you are. If Evenbob claimed to be an agnostic he could continue to ignore my attempts to show evidence that I am right or try to shoot them down (which I still wish he would do) and I wouldn't ask him to produce any evidence or logical reason for his position. However, he does not do this. He claims God is a fantasy and made up. Therefore he is making a positive statement that needs to be defended and moved forward.

Quote: Nareed

Going by what you say and how other people behave, I must ask: How does it feel to be the world's only real Christian?

Nareed I hope it doesn't pain you to say that I have never recieved on this forum a kinder post. Although it is undeserved and I only wish I could be a better Christian I can't tell you how much I appreciate it. Now if only I could live up to what I say.