Buying an Old Car

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April 11th, 2017 at 6:16:38 AM permalink
JimRockford
Member since: Sep 18, 2015
Threads: 0
Posts: 197
Quote: AZDuffman
Being able to drive a stick should be required to get your man card.

They should test you on an old pickup with three in the tree.
April 11th, 2017 at 7:43:35 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 103
Posts: 6774
Quote: JimRockford
They should test you on an old pickup with three in the tree.


Meh! Learn without syncromesh. My old man's Abercrombie Runabout had an International Harvester tranny without it, hardest car I ever had to drive!
The man who damns money has obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it has earned it
April 11th, 2017 at 10:45:46 AM permalink
JimRockford
Member since: Sep 18, 2015
Threads: 0
Posts: 197
Quote: AZDuffman
Meh! Learn without syncromesh. My old man's Abercrombie Runabout had an International Harvester tranny without it, hardest car I ever had to drive!

I don't want to derail the thread from giving advice to Face, but there has to be a story behind that car. Abercrombie Runabout, no s**t?
April 11th, 2017 at 11:25:00 AM permalink
JimRockford
Member since: Sep 18, 2015
Threads: 0
Posts: 197
Face, I've had good luck buying 2 to 3 year old cars from individuals. I avoid dealers, but you have to weed out the people posing as Individuals but are actually flipping cars out of their house as a sort of side hustle. Ask some questions about why they're selling and the history of the car and keep your BS detecter tuned up. No salvage titles. If I call them on the phone I just say I'm calling about the car. If they ask which one then no sale. Get a ballpark fair price from Edmunds, Kelly Blue Book and NADA, but adjust for actual condition.
April 11th, 2017 at 11:35:55 AM permalink
Face
Administrator
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 61
Posts: 3157
Quote: JimRockford
I don't want to derail the thread from giving advice to Face, but there has to be a story behind that car. Abercrombie Runabout, no s**t?


Derail away. I've no issue reading around it, and I'm a bit curious, too.

Quote: petroglyph
I assume you drive like you live? So you are going to want something that can take a beating?


I am proud to say I've cured myself from beating on my daily. I had this truck for 130k and only had it to 100 twice and peeled out maybe 4 times. Granted, I'm "hard" on vehicles because I tow frequently, live in a very hilly region, and do go off road (crawl, not race), but my personal habits now allow me more than a 40's era Willy's =)

Quote: petroglyph
I think you ought to get something that is already pre dented.


I'd not mind that. In fact, i think I'm pretty flexible with most of the particulars. I WOULD take a Dodge if it made sense, ditto for a Ford. Same with man vs auto, power vs manual, Eco-poop vs Hemi. Really, my only hard and fast rule is no cash only purchase, simply because I don't have the cash to do so (unless I wanted a $400 truck, and I already have one in the drive =p)

Essentially, I want to continue my upward momentum. I reckon the $3k I was in the hole when my Dodge blew up was rolled into my current ride, and probably add another K or two due to my impatient stupidity of walking in the store and walking out 4hrs later with the first truck I saw. I figure I erased that $5k-ish of mistake and even got roughly a year payment free paying this beast off, and I want to continue this progress. So while getting a '15 for low $20k's / high $10k's fits this picture, so too would a $4k job I could squeeze 4-5 years out of. If I have any priorities in this game, this would be it.

Quote: Evenbob
You know my advice. Go to a car auction
and look for a late model fleet car with
higher mileage and a stick and manual
windows. It will go for half of blue book.
I read last week two black guys killed
the driver of an expensive sports car
because it was a stick and they
couldn't drive it. Nobody want's to
drive a stick anymore.


I would do this in a heartbeat, as the kind of abuse they get (high miles, f#$%ed interior) don't concern me. But how? Just google "fleet auctions WNY"? The only one I know of is invite only dealer stuff.

Quote: AZDuffman

From this I assume you are buying about $3-8K of car. Either way, you can pull your credit at annualcreditrepot.com once a year per bureau for free. You have to pay for the FICO. Even paying cash it may pay because an error can raise your insurance. Insurance usually uses a blend of FICO and driving record. If you are going to look at a few vehicles does not hurt to get a quote on all. In my FL trip I did that for three, all were within $75 a year or so, but every now and then one similar one can have a high cost part or something. For example, go price tail lights for a new F-150 with the lane monitor feature. Then scream at someone else, not me.

A "work truck" with a manual may be harder than you think as many fleets want autos. But you can save money there as even people who can drive them will not buy one. (ahem!) So few out there but many people bleep right by them.

If you go to Erie, check the NY DMV first to be sure you do not have to pay tax twice. I got no preference for Erie unless it is a better drive. I will tell you in PA you have to go to a notary shop to do the title, unlike in NY where you sign and flip the keys.

Check for title liens! Even on junk!

Everyone in PA lies about what they bought the car for to save on sales tax, probably NY, too. But if it is too low they will ask why so cheap. Have a story, stick to it. Guy bought my Accent told the notary he paid $100 and OH send me an affidavit about it, which I threw in the trash. Perjury is not a hobby of mine. If you do this and things go bad, well if the guy bought my Accent came back IU would offer him his $100 back....get it?

If you only have a week or two you are under the gun. If you need financing, get it before you leave as dealers mark it up. Then start shopping. Look on Craigslist and eBay. Then look at dealer sites. There are a few "no negotiation" places like AutoNation but for sure you will have to hit Erie or Buffalo for that, maybe even Cleveland as they are BIG.

Let me know what else I can advise on.


I think I'm savvy on a bit of what you wrote. Especially the repairs stuff, which is why I'm skeert of foreign. Ever since I saw that Tundra with what looked like 4 catalytic converters, I've been trying real hard not to fall in love with one lol.

Since I'll be financing, I should do so out of shop to avoid hijinks? My credit union is a good spot (the head of my local is my next door neighbor) so I can hash out financial particulars quite easy indeed, even at 1900hrs over a spot of tea in her kitchen as I did my last loan lol. I guess... yeah, this is the stuff where I get a bit lost.

I'm good with the tangible things. I know what I need, what I can tolerate, etc, and have no worries of my eyes being bigger than my stomach. I'm not 20 anymore, don't want no 20" rims and a sunroof, so that part's set. Ditto for knowing what one should about the vehicle, from Carfax stuff to salvage titles to repairs and maintenance, so I'm not scared there. I think, and it sucks because this'll be a bitch to teach, where I come apart is the actual deal.

I'm too binary. I don't have that flexibility of character. I'm no good at haggling, massaging a deal, all that stuff. And I sure as s#$% don't have the patience to sit there and sweat someone out. How does one with this type of personality make it work? Just show up with my cash, tell THEM what I'll pay, and if no deal, turn right around and go home? I could do that, hell, I do that all the time. But how to make that work in my favor?

Seems I hear all the time guys bragging about this they did or that they did, essentially having the salesmen wooing them instead of the other way around. I have no idea how to begin to do that.
Be bold and risk defeat, or be cautious and encourage it.
April 11th, 2017 at 12:18:06 PM permalink
DRich
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 18
Posts: 762
Quote: AZDuffman
Either way, you can pull your credit at annualcreditrepot.com once a year per bureau for free. You have to pay for the FICO.


I am a huge proponent of CreditKarma.com. It is completely free and it updates and shows two of the three credit bureau FICO scores every week and shows the detail and balances on accounts. They also email you anytime a new account is opened so if fraud is involved you can address it immediately.
April 11th, 2017 at 12:18:34 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 103
Posts: 6774
Quote: Face
Derail away. I've no issue reading around it, and I'm a bit curious, too.


Later, I am at work now.

Quote:
Since I'll be financing, I should do so out of shop to avoid hijinks? My credit union is a good spot (the head of my local is my next door neighbor) so I can hash out financial particulars quite easy indeed, even at 1900hrs over a spot of tea in her kitchen as I did my last loan lol. I guess... yeah, this is the stuff where I get a bit lost.


The last thing you want is to be at the mercy of the dealer for finance. The best thing is find a lender who uses a "sight draft." This looks like a check, but what happens is the dealer calls the VIN in and gets an approval code so they can cash it. But you are pre-approved. Loan-to-Value will come into play and you must use it at a dealer, but they are great.

But even if they do not offer a SD, it is just good business to know what your rate is. Find your rate then find the "dollars per thousand per month" it will cost. Know your budget. Stick to your budget. DO NOT TRUST DEALER NUMBERS! One salesman at some dealer made a little table of payment per rate. How nice. But the payments were for a higher interest rate! He marked it up, made it look like the lower number, and nobody noticed until some finance guy bought a car and saw something was wrong. He ripped people off for years.

Find and figure what the car is worth and negotiate that. Payment buyers get screwed. When I bought my Accent I brought my financial calculator from work and told the salesman to just tell me his rate, I would figure the payments. My way of saying, "you want to play games with 20 year old strippers fine, but you do not play games with me!"

More later, if you have any probing questions ask away.
The man who damns money has obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it has earned it
April 11th, 2017 at 3:15:25 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 103
Posts: 6774
Quote: JimRockford
I don't want to derail the thread from giving advice to Face, but there has to be a story behind that car. Abercrombie Runabout, no s**t?


Quote: Face
Derail away. I've no issue reading around it, and I'm a bit curious, too.


Abercrombie Runabout a/k/a "Glassic."

They were called "Glassics" for the fiberglass they were made of and the lines of a Model A that they had. A run was made for Abercrombie & Fitch, which was sort of a different retailer then vs. now. One car was made and charged to each store. Managers hated this as it killed the P&L plus sat on inventory. Picture today a small store with a car on inventory. You sell it you do well, you don't your boss is all over you. Who goes to a specialty retailer for a car? I will not repeat the link any further, but there were some differences in the Abercrombie model vs the Glassic.

The car is an International Harvester Scout frame and running gear. Some were 4x4, silly as who would take it in snow and it took away what little back seat foot space there was. My dad let me drive his once, probably half in case something happened to him to be sure I could actually drive the thing.

Might be the shortest car I ever drove, I think it was shorter than my Accent based on parking them side by side once. It was without a doubt the hardest car I ever drove. I have driven some big, old cars, including a 1970 Cadillac hearse. But this thing, wow! As I said earlier, no syncromesh. You want to downshift to first you have to nearly stop. You want to downshift to third, buy a different car! The tranny had the same whine my school bus, also International Harvestor, had. Engine was a 4 banger, cut off of a V-8. IOW, heavy! You probably would have to really try to kill the motor or tranny. Anything less was just a car!

Oh, and steering! If you remember the 1970s you remember that cars of the era you kind of guessed at the steering and whee position. This was that kind of car.

When he went to sell it he had me put it on eBay. One guy asked if it could make it to NC. I told the guy mechanically should be no issue, but "this thing is not a Camry, fun to drive an hour or two, ten will wear you out!"

It did not sell on eBay, dad traded it for a Solara Convertible. He could not handle the old cars any longer. Traded it at a regular Toyota dealer. Curiously the dealer sold it in a day or two. I was surprised they did not keep it in the showroom a week or so to generate traffic. But a sale is a sale.

The man who damns money has obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it has earned it
April 11th, 2017 at 11:38:56 PM permalink
petroglyph
Member since: Aug 3, 2014
Threads: 12
Posts: 2119
Quote: Face
I am proud to say I've cured myself from beating on my daily. I had this truck for 130k and only had it to 100 twice and peeled out maybe 4 times. Granted, I'm "hard" on vehicles because I tow frequently, live in a very hilly region, and do go off road (crawl, not race), but my personal habits now allow me more than a 40's era Willy's =)
That is remarkable, I couldn't seem to get more than 80-90k using the same set up?

Why don't you re-power the one you have, and save money for a good boat?
Everyone gets thrown from the plane to maintain altitude
April 12th, 2017 at 11:07:49 AM permalink
Face
Administrator
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 61
Posts: 3157
Quote: petroglyph
That is remarkable, I couldn't seem to get more than 80-90k using the same set up?


I'm very proud. My previous record of my miles on a car was 40k. I've tripled it plus some, and I'm still going =D

Quote: petro
Why don't you re-power the one you have, and save money for a good boat?


To be honest, I am snake bit and not thinking clearly. That Dodge f#$%arow really put a stain on my spirit when it comes to major surgery. But since you mentioned it, let's to take a look.

Well, she's a tired old git, as you saw in the Resto-rant thread. 14yrs of NY winters show clear as day. Cosmetically she's a wreck, as while my paint job is Good Enough, I didn't do near enough prep and it's all rot back through. This I'm not concerned about; in fact, I like it. It's a mechanical representation of me, in a way lol. And it's a real treat going to the crick without worrying about branches or high rocks, ditto for getting big, heavy things in and out of the back. Bang the side? Don't f#$%ing care. That's something I consider a "value". And really, the "important" parts of having a body are things I can piecemeal and take care of myself. New bed, new doors (when it's time), things like that. On this front, I'd be MORE THAN HAPPY to carry on with her.

Structurally, I think I'm good. I didn't blacklight/xray the damn thing, of course, but I don't fear a shock mount rotting off as it did Pop's Dakota. And anyway, that's rough work. I'd have no problem burning on a mount for shocks, motor, tranny, or anything else that breaks off it in the future. And really, she's been so good and is solid enough that I don't fear frame issues in the near OR distant future.

System wise is where most of my fear lies. I've no worries for the non-critical stuff; most of that flew the coop some time ago. My missing lights in the dash, my missing resistors for climate control settings, ABS, all that can stay gone and I'll remain happy as a clam. It's the bigger, critical, and expensive stuff I fear.

Let's see... the pumpkin cover rotted and was just replaced this year, so I know my rear end is good so we can strike that out. I just had a new (60k - 80k) tranny put in, so that's good. Full / complete brakes on back, and either new or refurb complete brakes on front. Four new skins for the wheels. And that exhaust must be made of f#$%ing invincibilium, because it is also 170k miles old and doesn't even have a pinhole in it. Absolutely staggered about that. I know I'm forgetting a few expensive concerns (maybe you can remind me), but for the most part, the engine is the only thing "wrong".

I use quotes because it's gone funny on me. Smoking was my problem. I mean big ol 1970's Bad Company weed hit bad. On a calm morn, I'd obscure three properties when I started it up. I ain't never seen a working engine smoke like that. How it's gone "funny" is it only does it on a cold start. Big ol fwoom of blue smoke, and it ceases before I put it in gear and doesn't smoke the rest of the trip. It actually didn't smoke at all last I fired it up, but hearing my valves rattle like castanets clued me into why - it's was low on / out of oil. Topped her off yesterday.... and it ain't smoked since.

So sure, could be that we're just dealing with a bunk system allowing oil in the chamber and my engine is fine (well, fine as 170k can be) but my luck states I must plan for the worst. Maybe AZD can help with this part - assuming ~$3k bill (reckon I can get a new 602 for ~$2k plus labor) how long should the truck as a whole last to get the value out of the investment? I know that's a wide and varied answer, but... I'm looking for anything lol.
Be bold and risk defeat, or be cautious and encourage it.
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