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January 16th, 2018 at 10:28:04 AM permalink
Dalex64
Member since: Mar 8, 2014
Threads: 3
Posts: 2613
Quote: AZDuffman


Bad deal is worse than no deal. Until we get a wall and address security better, let DACA die. Being more concerned with Americans than illegal aliens will not hurt his standing at all.


A large majority of Americans support a clean DACA bill.

but he's not killing it because it is a good deal, or a bad deal. He is killing it because someone pissed him off. At least, that is what he is saying.

If he is really killing it because he agrees with you and we need a wall and better security first, then he lacks the guts to admit it.

That makes him a weak individual unwilling to stand up for what he believes in, instead he is falling back on deception and pretense.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan
January 16th, 2018 at 10:36:57 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 110
Posts: 8637
Quote: Dalex64
A large majority of Americans support a clean DACA bill.
so

Don't be so sure. His election was in large part based on people tired of an open border policy. And well, if someone pissed him off who should have been negotiating in good faith, let DACA die.

He has indicated he will do DACA for a wall and better security. Democrats are scared to death of both.
The man who damns money has obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it has earned it
January 16th, 2018 at 10:53:31 AM permalink
petroglyph
Member since: Aug 3, 2014
Threads: 18
Posts: 3193
Quote: AZDuffman
We are paying for it already in the form of services to illegal aliens, from schooling to welfaere to prisons.
So then, Amnesty and a wall? Heck of a deal, and a tax cut to boot. This guy is a ****ing magician.

Conservatism is great, "until you run out of other peoples money".

The truth is, nobody wants to get rid of slaves that will work beneath minimum wage. The pols just bandy about this term or that, and feed all the tax mules more grass, with free DWTS on the wide screen. Dire Straits; "Money for nothin and chicks for free."

The difference between the red/blue team is a fine line at best, or more accurately, "an illusion", while the media runs distractions 24/7.
Everyone gets thrown from the plane to maintain altitude
January 16th, 2018 at 10:56:22 AM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 121
Posts: 15576
Stocks Soaring: Dow Crosses 26,000

Trump says he won't apologize for
shithole remark he never made and
the market goes crazy with optimism.
Obama given credit on CNN..

LOLOL
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
January 16th, 2018 at 11:04:17 AM permalink
boymimbo
Member since: Mar 25, 2013
Threads: 5
Posts: 732
Quote: AZDuffman
so

Don't be so sure. His election was in large part based on people tired of an open border policy. And well, if someone pissed him off who should have been negotiating in good faith, let DACA die.

He has indicated he will do DACA for a wall and better security. Democrats are scared to death of both.


DACA is different from an open border policy. It was introduced to protect children of illegals from their parent's actions.

I don't think Democrats are afraid of a wall. I think they are reasonably sure that it won't keep out bad hombres, who will just dig tunnels, ladders, find better ways to smuggle in trucks, use boats, fly planes and drones, etc over a wall. The bad hombres that we talk about are usually those dealing with drugs, where money is plentiful and the border wall is not much of deterrent. They are not the poor coming from central american countries to seek a better and peaceful life.

The Democrats are afraid of "better security", because Trump's definition of "better security" is:
- keeping out refugees from countries where extreme vetting already occurs.
- keeping out Muslims by enforcing travel bans in countries where terrorism is not a threat but Islam is.
- keeping out people from s**thole countries (the entirety of Africa and Haiti) where people are in extreme poverty and can't help themselves to a better life because their nation's infrastructures don't provide it.

I believe that American and the West should be hospitable to those who are escaping war and extreme poverty to provide them a better life. The West (up until now) have held this view for centuries. Ellis Island for a long time accepted anyone. A good refugee program who allows in immigrants from those countries (which now exists) with vetting will accomplish this. A Visa lottery program (which now exists) also accomplishes this and limits the number of incoming immigrants. The various visa programs for Students, Specialized Workers, Business, Entertainers, etc also allow people to come in and work and study and contribute peacefully to America's economy and better themselves and the world.

I also believe (as some Democrats do) in enforcement, in getting rid of illegals (especially those who commit crimes), and that state and local authorities should be cooperating with ICE. I also support the stand of local and state authorities to not turn in illegals as their involvement in policing and being part of communities is essential to help fight crime.

Finally, America does need immigration to do the crappy jobs that Americans won't do. This includes temporary farm help and minimum wage jobs. As the nation reaches full employment, filling these low paying jobs will become more difficult and a decent immigration program that allows for temporary work will be necessary.
January 16th, 2018 at 11:05:15 AM permalink
boymimbo
Member since: Mar 25, 2013
Threads: 5
Posts: 732
Quote: Evenbob
Stocks Soaring: Dow Crosses 26,000

Trump says he won't apologize for
shithole remark he never made and
the market goes crazy with optimism.
Obama given credit on CNN..

LOLOL


The events are not related. Why would the stock marketed be affected by what Trump says about immigration?
January 16th, 2018 at 11:08:02 AM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 132
Posts: 6583
Trump promised in the televised meeting that he would sign on to a bipartisan immigration bill if it was brought to him. It was. He didn't.

That's the news as I see it.
Nobody learned anything from the global financial crisis.
January 16th, 2018 at 11:10:18 AM permalink
Nareed
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 345
Posts: 12535
Shithole country about to legalize all drugs:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com.mx/entry/norway-decriminalize-drug-use_us_5a387b70e4b0860bf4aa96c4
Donald Trump is a fucking liar
January 16th, 2018 at 11:12:30 AM permalink
Dalex64
Member since: Mar 8, 2014
Threads: 3
Posts: 2613
Quote: AZDuffman
so

Don't be so sure. His election was in large part based on people tired of an open border policy. And well, if someone pissed him off who should have been negotiating in good faith, let DACA die.

He has indicated he will do DACA for a wall and better security. Democrats are scared to death of both.


The polls supporting that opinion are out there. Many of them, from different companies, at different times. Here is just one of them.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/09/28/fox-news-poll-83-percent-support-pathway-to-citizenship-for-illegal-immigrants.html

Quote:
Large majorities of voters favor granting work permits or citizenship to illegal immigrants who were brought to the United States as children, according to the latest Fox News poll.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan
January 16th, 2018 at 11:17:57 AM permalink
Dalex64
Member since: Mar 8, 2014
Threads: 3
Posts: 2613
Quote: AZDuffman
And well, if someone pissed him off who should have been negotiating in good faith, let DACA die.


The pissing-off didn't happen until after reporters made his comments public, after the meeting. He is pissed at a democrat for truthfully answering a reporters question, not for someone negotiating in bad faith.

I know you don't want DACA, but you keep throwing up strawman after strawman as for why this particular negotiation and future bill should be rejected.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." Daniel Patrick Moynihan