Gay Marriage

May 12th, 2014 at 12:50:53 PM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 188
Posts: 18632
This is a general statement and if anyone responds that is their own doing.

My name has been brought up many many times on this thread talking about me without a response from me. I had at least as much right to respond. And I didn't take up much space or time.
You believe in an invisible god, and dismiss people who say they are trans? Really?
May 12th, 2014 at 4:28:37 PM permalink
Face
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 61
Posts: 3941
Quote: Beethoven

Huh? I don't know how you can say that. That's simply not true at all. I've written to you at least twice in the past about not calling anyone "Shifty" or "Mr. Tangent" anymore. That's not an acknowledgement????


Real quick on this, yes, you have. I was rather talking about this particular thread. I suppose that was lost in the difficulty of communicating by text.

Quote: Beethoven

Well, we've now written several mini-novels back and forth for the viewing pleasure of [name withheld], but at least we're getting practice with our writing skills. lol


Indeed we have, and I'm tired. I've got about an hour before BOS v MON, so I'm gonna bang this out real quick and then go have several wobbly pops.

But everything that's just transpired between my last post and now is killing me. This is what I mean, and not just with you, and not just with rxwine. I mean with nearly every single issue that required mod intervention, I hate the times when it has to be so difficult. I mean, how long can two people spat for? You don't like him, he doesn't like you. You know it, he knows it, I know it, every single person who's been at DT or WoV for more than a month is completely aware of it. So what's the end game here?

Is it either of your goals to bait the other into getting nuked? Is it either of your goals to martyr yourself and secure a Pyrrhic victory? I really, honestly and truly do not get it. Because all of this affects everyone who comes in contact with it. Some it just annoys. Some it fires up and causes them to choose sides (which further exacerbates future situations). It stresses the mods out, it stresses the owner out, and to what end? I've no doubt some pleasure is derived when a foe is under the gun. I also imagine everyone has allies who either find enjoyment or displeasure when one of their own or an opponent gets put under the microscope. But at what cost? Please, someone tell me, anyone tell me - What is the purpose, and is this all worth it?

Quote: Beethoven

Just thinking aloud here...I still don't get why every potential solution is on the table EXCEPT: "Block Beethoven & get over it!" This approach clearly worked when it concerned his "This guy is much like you" barb, so I'm scratching my head trying to figure out why that option (which, again, worked like a charm) no longer exists around here??? It's the simplest solution of all! Oh well, I'm not an admin here, so that decision isn't mine to make.


This is a fair and decent question that deserves answering. The reason I haven't suggested it is, again, my personal beliefs. I think the block button is one of the most idiotic and useless functions of any board today. Because the block button only works if the blocker wants it to. Let's say I got tired of this back and forth of ours and I block you. The only thing thing keeping me from reading anything you post is leaving you blocked, it only works by NOT pressing another stupid little button. I have to make that choice. How in the world is that any different from me just saying "self, don't read what he writes", "self, don't respond to what he writes", "self, completely ignore anything he does"? Because I chose in a moment to click a button, this suddenly solves the problem? This dumb little button, which serves only to highlight my opponent by way of making a thread look odd and at times unreadable, this dumb little button that still allows quoted portions to show, this button is supposed to be a tool of mine, a panacea to solve all forum ills?

I can't offer it as an option because I don't believe it to be one. If asked before I started this, I would've said that I had the mutual respect of both you and rxwine. I have been given the power and responsibility of managing Mike's house by Mike himself, the place where all of this is taking place and the owner of said place. If asked right now, I'd say yes, you both mutually respect him. If a simple request by one if not two mutually respected persons to not taunt, troll, or otherwise disrespect each other won't work, I have less than zero faith that the block button will accomplish what we alone cannot.

With that, I'm out of things to say and I don't know what to do. I fight with rxwine about guns and enjoy him in my thread about cars. I fight with you, Beeth, now over my management and I enjoy you in the threads about music. I won't pull an mkl and make a poll having the members choose who needs to go. I won't pull Mike into this and give him yet another thing he has to deal with. And I don't want to make a special set of rules regarding you two. I think you're both above it, I know I don't want to police it, and I don't want to encourage even more games. It is my hope, again, that a Festivus miracle will come early and I'll come back to see a mutual truce. Or maybe I'll come back drunk and angry after Montreal's upcoming loss and just nuke everyone out of spite. Maybe I'll just nuke myself right now. I dunno. I'm out of ideas.

I do want to end with an apology, though. To rxwine, for putting him on blast in this thread. To TheCessPit, AZD, and every other person I referred to personally and dragged into it. To every single member who's viewed this thread and had the drama caused by my decision infuse their lives. And lastly to you, Beethoven, if I've made you felt singled out or have otherwise handled this inappropriately.
Be bold and risk defeat, or be cautious and encourage it.
May 12th, 2014 at 5:18:43 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: Face


This is a fair and decent question that deserves answering. The reason I haven't suggested it is, again, my personal beliefs. I think the block button is one of the most idiotic and useless functions of any board today. Because the block button only works if the blocker wants it to. Let's say I got tired of this back and forth of ours and I block you. The only thing thing keeping me from reading anything you post is leaving you blocked, it only works by NOT pressing another stupid little button. I have to make that choice. How in the world is that any different from me just saying "self, don't read what he writes", "self, don't respond to what he writes", "self, completely ignore anything he does"? Because I chose in a moment to click a button, this suddenly solves the problem? This dumb little button, which serves only to highlight my opponent by way of making a thread look odd and at times unreadable, this dumb little button that still allows quoted portions to show, this button is supposed to be a tool of mine, a panacea to solve all forum ills?


With all due respect, I have to disagree here and say I find the button useful and others should as well. You are correct in that you can just press "unblock." In that regard, the block feature here is not the best I have seen on a forum, I'm not complaining and I am not asking the admin to do more programming. I am just saying some I have seen are set up so you don't even see the person has posted,

I think the only active person I have blocked is Nareed. He and I have each other mutually blocked for 3-4 years or however long the block feature has been available. He decided he didn't want to discuss gay issues with someone who disagreed with him and I later did not like what I saw as his bashing of religion. Since an initial message or two no issues at all. Then there was those MKL and Logan guys. I just got tired of both so after blocking them I did not have to even look at their posts. Yes, you can unblock, but it is nice not to have to see the offending posts.


Quote:
I do want to end with an apology, though. To rxwine, for putting him on blast in this thread. To TheCessPit, AZD, and every other person I referred to personally and dragged into it. To every single member who's viewed this thread and had the drama caused by my decision infuse their lives. And lastly to you, Beethoven, if I've made you felt singled out or have otherwise handled this inappropriately.


Apology accepted but it was not needed at all.
The President is a fink.
May 12th, 2014 at 5:26:44 PM permalink
zippyboy
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 2
Posts: 665
Quote: AZDuffman
I think the only active person I have blocked is Nareed. He and I have each other mutually blocked for 3-4 years or however long the block feature has been available.

Me too.
May 12th, 2014 at 7:04:05 PM permalink
Beethoven
Member since: Apr 27, 2014
Threads: 18
Posts: 640
Quote: Face
I do want to end with an apology, though...And lastly to you, Beethoven, if I've made you felt singled out or have otherwise handled this inappropriately
Apology accepted. But after the way you've explained everything in this whole exchange, I agree with AZ, no apology is/was needed at all.


Quote: Face
Real quick on this, yes, you have. I was rather talking about this particular thread. I suppose that was lost in the difficulty of communicating by text.
Ah, this time, my apologies. :) I totally misunderstood.


Quote: Face
I think the block button is one of the most idiotic and useless functions of any board today.
Quote: AZDuffman
With all due respect, I have to disagree here and say I find the button useful and others should as well.
I hate sounding like a broken record since I tend to "+1" lots of AZ's posts :) but I have to agree with him here.

I'll say this. Two users here (who can't stand me, BTW) whom I respect are s2dbaker and Nareed. In the past, they each announced that they were blocking me and would no longer address me at all on the forum, and they both followed through. You gotta respect that. No whining about my posts, no chiming in threads uninvited to stir the pot...NONE of that. I personally don't dislike either of them (or, for that matter, anyone else here on WoV/DT), and I totally respect them for refusing to cause any drama. Too bad others can't do the same.


Quote: Face
But everything that's just transpired between my last post and now is killing me...

What is the purpose, and is this all worth it?
Me too, and who knows...

What I do know is that I am also genuinely at a loss regarding what to do. Earlier in this thread, I engaged the perpetrator, but then I got criticized for doing so (which is what started our extended correspondence). "OK," I thought to myself. "I'll just report him next time instead and not reciprocate, even if he calls me a troll again."

So after I saw this most recent personal attack:
Quote: rxwine
I take responsibility for my words. I have trolled trolls. That's for sure.
...I didn't engage the perpetrator and simply reported him for calling me a "troll" again.

But apparently that's not the right thing to do either! I gotta be honest, if I can't respond back, and if reporting his personal attacks doesn't get results, then what am I supposed to do??????
Boron Boron Boron rhymes with moron, moron, moron
May 12th, 2014 at 7:28:14 PM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 188
Posts: 18632
Quote: Beethoven
...I didn't engage the perpetrator and simply reported him for calling me a "troll" again.

But apparently that's not the right thing to do either! I gotta be honest, if I can't respond back, and if reporting his personal attacks doesn't get results, then what am I supposed to do??????


I let you go on for pages without commenting on it. Would you like me to start framing comments you made about me as insults. Because I can. Wizard has said, even truth as insults won't protect us.

Calling me a perpetrator is possibly over the line as well.
You believe in an invisible god, and dismiss people who say they are trans? Really?
May 12th, 2014 at 7:47:02 PM permalink
Beethoven
Member since: Apr 27, 2014
Threads: 18
Posts: 640
Quote: rxwine
I let you go on for pages without commenting on it. Would you like me to start framing comments you made about me as insults. Because I can. Wizard has said, even truth as insults won't protect us.

Calling me a perpetrator is possibly over the line as well.
He's doing it again. *sigh*

I'm going to flag this post immediately.
Boron Boron Boron rhymes with moron, moron, moron
May 12th, 2014 at 7:51:59 PM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 188
Posts: 18632
Do it. If I can't comment on why someone isn't banning me, there something wrong here. Either that or take that question to PM.
You believe in an invisible god, and dismiss people who say they are trans? Really?
May 12th, 2014 at 7:54:19 PM permalink
Beethoven
Member since: Apr 27, 2014
Threads: 18
Posts: 640
Quote: rxwine
Do it. If I can't comment on why someone isn't banning me, there something wrong here. Either that or take that question to PM.
Flagged.


EDIT: Just an interesting aside. I looked at the number of suspensions for 2013—when the forum rules were much more lenient—and I counted 70 suspensions for the entire year. Then I looked at the number of suspensions for 2014—after the forum rules became much more strict at the beginning of the year—and I counted 50 suspensions. (And remember, we're not even halfway through the year.)

Also, I took a peek at the "Discussion" thread on WoV. For the first THREE years, there were only 181 pages in that thread. In the first 5 months of 2014, there have been 142 pages and counting. And this doesn't even take into account the dramatic increase in the number of contentious public spats which have occurred since the rule change.

Is it possible, perhaps, that more regulation has actually led to more (instead of fewer) stress-creating problems for the forum? And that more freedom of speech on the board actually worked better? I don't know the answer, I'm just asking.
Boron Boron Boron rhymes with moron, moron, moron
May 13th, 2014 at 2:57:06 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: Beethoven


Also, I took a peek at the "Discussion" thread on WoV. For the first THREE years, there were only 181 pages in that thread. In the first 5 months of 2014, there have been 142 pages and counting. And this doesn't even take into account the dramatic increase in the number of contentious public spats which have occurred since the rule change.


The "Discussion" thread over there seems to have gotten more posts because so many people keep wanting to discuss minutia. I rarely post there because it has become like some college campus word police star chamber that finds more and more speech to code as offensive on one part and a bunch of attorneys trying to find a loophole on the other part.

As an example, if WoV was debating wording a sign for the HOV lane it would go something like this:

"Lets make it say 'Vehicles With 2 Persons or More."
"That might be offensive to people who do not identify as human"
"What if it is a pregnant woman? Isn't the child still a person? We really need to say '2 persons in 2 seats."
"Why is it 2 and not 4?"
"We just want to make a simple rule here."
"I still find it offensive to say just 'persons.' We should say 'humans.'"
"Jerry Logan just got suspended for creating his 143rd identity"
""Yeah, that reminds me, if a person had multiple personalities they could claim they are 2,3, or even 10 persons. We really should say something about that."
"yadda, yadda, yadda....."
The President is a fink.