Gun Control

Truth is that if someone breaks into my home, they are welcome to take what they will. My insurance covers the burglary. If I am home they are welcome to take what they want. They are very likely not going to murder me unless I give them a good reason to. The fact is, here, that i don't have access to a gun. I can't carry. I can't own an accessible handgun. Most Canadians except for police officers are in the same boat. Robbers want my stuff. They don't want me and they don't want my wife. In the very rare event that they come after me and tie me up, and gag me, and pistol whip me, at the end of the day, I'm still alive, battered and bruised, but still alive, and it is likely that the police would give the case very special attention. The fact is that I live in an ordinary house in an ordinary neigbourhood and I don't stand out. If I am the target of a home invasion for some random reason, then I attribute that to God's will and leave it at that.

If your theory was right you would expect the murder rate to be much higher as criminals with guns (you would assume that the same percent of the criminal element would have guns here in Canada, because if they want an illegal handgun, it's very easy to go so) and you would expect the robbery rate to be much higher to with no element of deterrence here. But it isn't. So, your argument that owning handguns deters robbers is simply wrong, unless you ping a magical element like societal differences. But even in urban centres where the societal influences are similar, rates are much lower.

Quote: Evenbob

That's because naive people think real life
situations happen just like they do on TV.
They don't, not even close. Real life fist
fights last about 15-20 seconds, if that long.
If you get mugged, it's over almost before
you realize it happened. If you catch a stranger
in your home, he's going run, or immediately
do something violent. He's not going to get
into a conversation with you or give you chance
to shoot him in the knee.

The USA is totally stupid when it comes to believing what they see on screen. They think cars blow up at the slightest hit, they think you can run into a wildly burning building with no equipment then find and rescue someone, they think it is easy to hit a target with a pistol from a good distance with no time to aim, and you name other things.

"Mythbusters" has helped in this regard, but like most things the people who watch are not the ones who need to watch. How many of you have had the conversation:

"That car could have blown up!"
"It might but probably not."
"How do you know?"
"Because cars are designed NOT to blow up, you really need to try to make them blow up."
"But it happens on TV?"

I don't even really try anymore, rather just hang with the non-alarmists and shake our heads.

Sorry to rant, just got off dealing craps with a partner who was very misinformed about the game. Then had to explain to not one but two of our pit-bosses that you do need to hit the wall or it is no roll. Had to pull out the "well when I was in class" line which I really hate to do in that way. But arguing about hitting the wall?

Quote: AZDuffman

Another chain says gun owners need not show up.

Now, I can see where they say, "Hey, please do not carry an assault rifle in over your shoulder. And that includes the military, who BTW is why drive-thru was first invented for. It just isn't a polite thing to do.

But why do they always just ban responsible conceal carry folks?

Believe it or not, I sort of agree with you.

Here's the photo that started it all:



This photo made for the perfect anti-gun propaganda for the gun control activists. These 2 idiots thought they had a Constitutional right to bring in the biggest guns they could find, and then post a pic on Facebook for all the world to see. They finally came to their senses and deleted the Facebook photo, but the damage had been done, it was too late. It turns out the gun control activists also use Facebook (duh!) and so they downloaded the image, got a zillion petition signatures, and (easily) convinced Chipotle to make an across the board ban on all guns.

Chipotle wants moms to bring their kids in for a taco, and moms get nervous around guns that big. Chipotle serves alcohol. Chipotle does not want moms to see these 2 idiots drinking alcohol at Chipotle. Yes, Chipotle overreacted by banning all guns, maybe allowing licensed conceal & carry small handguns would be ok. But these 2 Rambos inadvertantly handed over an easy win to the gun control activists.

It's all about context:

Hustler magazine ought to be legal, but that doesn't mean you have a Constitutional right to "read" Hustler at Chipotle. They'll kick you out.

Singing loudly at the top of your lungs in the privacy of your own car ought to be legal, but that doesn't mean you have a Constitutional right to sing at the top of your lungs inside Chipotle. They'll kick you out.

And it ought to be legal to bring an enormous semi-automatic to the shooting range. Just don't bring it into Chipotle. They'll kick you out.

Quote: reno

Hustler magazine ought to be legal, but that doesn't mean you have a Constitutional right to "read" Hustler at Chipotle. They'll kick you out.

Singing loudly at the top of your lungs in the privacy of your own car ought to be legal, but that doesn't mean you have a Constitutional right to sing at the top of your lungs inside Chipotle. They'll kick you out.

And it ought to be legal to bring an enormous semi-automatic to the shooting range. Just don't bring it into Chipotle. They'll kick you out.

I wasn't aware the US Constitution mentioned Chipolte at all. But the sad fact here is had the manager at Chipolte been professional and asked them to leave and discussed why rationally it would have ended there.

Quote: AZDuffman

I wasn't aware the US Constitution mentioned Chipolte at all. The problem is society thinks the US Constitution covers private folk, it does not.

But the sad fact here is had the manager at Chipolte been professional and asked them to leave and discussed why rationally it would have ended there.

Quote: boymimbo

Truth is that if someone breaks into my home, they are welcome to take what they will...They are very likely not going to murder me...

...because we all know that thieves are very moral people who wouldn't hurt a fly. lol

Quote: boymimbo

Truth is that if someone breaks into my home, they are welcome to take what they will.

Would that include your wife and daughter? Will insurance cover that?

I have to think Boymimbo's post is entirely facetious. No one is naive enough to think that everyone breaking into a home is simply a cat burglar. There are numerous cases of a husband being restrained and the wife raped, other sorts of unspeakable physical harm, etc. Precisely why the bad guys will be eternally sorry if they ever break into my home because I'm not going to help them carry the TV to the van while asking what their real intentions are. I'm going to shoot them right where they stand without a thought to what the law may or may not say about the whole event.

Quote: chickenman

I have to think Boymimbo's post is entirely facetious.

You have to remember he's Canadian. Entirely different culture, even though it seems to mirror ours on the outside. He can't even have a pistol, and if he wants a long gun, it has to remain locked up at all times. Despite the fact that he and I can wave at each other from across the river, the lands we live on are vastly different.

Just compare any river city. Look at one side of Pittsburgh vs the other side of the river. Pretty much the same, no? Now compare Niagara Falls ONT with Niagara Falls NY. BIG damn difference.

Quote: AZDuffman

Move down. Bring your shop. We'll build a 426 Hemi.

I have to. I already promised Pops I would if NYSAFE doesn't get beat down. I'm tired of being a felon for no other reason than Supreme Leader decrees it, and it'll be a cold day in hell before the People's Republic takes a gun of mine.

Although by "down", it'd likely be a western border town like Bradford. I dunno what "down" means to you. Hell, get my custody mess settled and who knows what I'll do. I just might bug out to Wyoming permanently =p

On the Chipotle tough guys, I wish they were here so I could headbutt them directly. I can't ever condone this. There is just no reason for it.

That's what I mean by my "pragmatic support of open carry". Even here in NY, open carry is sometimes looked the other way. Hunting season is one of those times. It is totally common to see a man or 4 walking down the road with rifles and boom sticks slung over their shoulder. It is common for a man to go into a convenience store with a pistol exposed under his opened jacket. That's one thing. But very, very rarely is it necessary to do what these clowns did.

In very small towns where walking or four wheeling is how you get from the woods to wherever, it's OK (my definition of OK) to enter a store with a long gun. You need some milk or coffee or a doughnut, then fine. But your gun, if a long gun, should be fit snug on its strap, tight against your back. A cross sling carry, or an elbow carry if you have no strap, are the only appropriate ways, and the gun should be broken or the action open. You're not toting around a long gun in public for SD.

To come into a restaurant with a two hand carry is just asinine. Had I been there, my pistol would've been drawn under the table, assuming these jackwads were the next Cleibold and Harris. I mean, wtf?

Nope. Don't support this at all, and I shun any who would do such a thing. They just make things harder for me.

Yes, I get the Canadian part, was more following through with Beethoven's and AZD's comments. It's a bit of a head in the sand, eh?