Circle half the population of the world

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November 13th, 2016 at 2:09:27 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: stinkingliberal
Allowing minority votes to count will turn us into a banana republic.


They count, just in proportion to everybody
else. If it was your guy who won like Trump
won, you'd be jumping up and down like
an 8 year old girl at her b-day party instead
of being bitter and resentful.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
November 13th, 2016 at 3:44:40 PM permalink
stinkingliberal
Member since: Nov 9, 2016
Threads: 17
Posts: 731
Quote: Aussie
I'm sure the rest of the forum will be thrilled to have the poster formerly known as mkl654321 on a different board deciding who they will and won't tolerate. :S


I'm sure there are only a few people who are so tightly wound that they care one way or another.
November 13th, 2016 at 3:46:12 PM permalink
stinkingliberal
Member since: Nov 9, 2016
Threads: 17
Posts: 731
Quote: Evenbob
They count, just in proportion to everybody
else. If it was your guy who won like Trump
won, you'd be jumping up and down like
an 8 year old girl at her b-day party instead
of being bitter and resentful.


Don't misrepresent a quotation. I was quoting another poster. Taking what people say out of context is a childish and crude tactic.
November 13th, 2016 at 3:51:58 PM permalink
kenarman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 14
Posts: 4470
Quote: stinkingliberal
Ahh, more Trumper racism. Allowing minority votes to count will turn us into a banana republic. Statements like that may fill you with pride, but they're actually quite disgusting.

I do agree that we should keep dynasty families like the Bushes from dominating politics :)


Or Kennedys
"but if you make yourselves sheep, the wolves will eat you." Benjamin Franklin
November 13th, 2016 at 4:56:38 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
Quote: kenarman
Or Kennedys


Or almost Clinton's. Now there's talk
about Michele running for congress
and then president so they can
continue Barry's 3rd term. Never
gonna happen.
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
November 13th, 2016 at 5:03:18 PM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: AZDuffman
Even then they could see that just a few places might dominate and the only fair way is indirect voting so that all regions had to be paid attention to.


It must have taken true vision. Two years after the constitution was ratified, only 24 urban places with population over 2500 were counted. Philadelphia city, Northern Liberties township, and Southwark district in Pennsylvania were combined into one city 65 years later. There was only one urban area south of Virginia.

1 New York city, NY *..................... 33,131
2 Philadelphia city, PA *................. 28,522
3 Boston town, MA *....................... 18,320
4 Charleston city, SC..................... 16,359
5 Baltimore town, MD...................... 13,503
6 Northern Liberties township, PA *....... 9,913
7 Salem town, MA.......................... 7,921
8 Newport town, RI........................ 6,716
9 Providence town, RI *................... 6,380
10t Marblehead town, MA..................... 5,661
10t Southwark district, PA *................ 5,661

12 Gloucester town, MA..................... 5,317
13 Newburyport town, MA.................... 4,837
14 Portsmouth town, NH..................... 4,720
15 Sherburne town (Nantucket), MA *........ 4,620
16 Middleborough town, MA.................. 4,526
17 New Haven city, CT *.................... 4,487
18 Richmond city, VA....................... 3,761
19 Albany city, NY......................... 3,498
20 Norfolk borough, VA..................... 2,959
21 Petersburg town, VA..................... 2,828
22 Alexandria town, VA *................... 2,748
23 Hartford city, CT *..................... 2,683
24 Hudson city, NY......................... 2,584

The Great Compromise brought all the states together by guaranteeing that the smallest states would have at least 3 members of Congress. Otherwise the Union would not have been formed. The Electoral college simply reflected the congressional allocation.

It's important, however, to distinguish between the Electoral College and the "Winner take All" (WTA) method of allocation EC votes. The WTA is not in the constitution, and was simply adopted by states to give them maximum clout. If all fifty states used the Main/Nebraska system of allocating EC votes then the outcome would have been different. Romney won 99 congressional districts in states won by Obama, and Obama won 32 congressional districts in states won by Romney. If they used the Nebraska/Maine system Romney would have won 99-32=67 additional EC votes, and he only needed 64 more to become POTUS.

Most rational human beings understand using a pure popular vote would run the danger of near riots in determining the validity of very close elections or determining the POTUS if their are three or more nearly equal candidates. But much of the objections to the EC are actually objections to the WTA system.
November 13th, 2016 at 5:28:57 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: Pacomartin


Most rational human beings understand using a pure popular vote would run the danger of near riots in determining the validity of very close elections or determining the POTUS if their are three or more nearly equal candidates. But much of the objections to the EC are actually objections to the WTA system.


It would lead to tyranny. Think about it. Look at the political machines in NY and Chicago alone. One Party Rule. GOP only got to be mayor because the place was unlivable. NYC's only GOP AG in 60 years was on "Law and Order." Chicago is run in a way Putin would admire. How much more voter fraud if the general was popular vote? The USA would be Mexico.
The President is a fink.
November 13th, 2016 at 5:31:45 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: Evenbob
Or almost Clinton's. Now there's talk
about Michele running for congress
and then president so they can
continue Barry's 3rd term. Never
gonna happen.


I keep wondering if people are serious about that. Liberals would love it, but even if they find a safe Senate seat she is just not personable for politics. I don't think he has the same mafia-like control of the party Bill had to set Hillary up.
The President is a fink.
November 13th, 2016 at 6:40:00 PM permalink
Evenbob
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 146
Posts: 25010
New WaPo/ABC poll shows 75% of Americans
are OK with the election, 14% think it's
not legit. Compare that to 2000 when
11% thought Bush winning was not
legit. So we've been here before, sore
loserville. Big yawn..
If you take a risk, you may lose. If you never take a risk, you will always lose.
November 13th, 2016 at 6:45:06 PM permalink
stinkingliberal
Member since: Nov 9, 2016
Threads: 17
Posts: 731
Quote: Pacomartin

Most rational human beings understand using a pure popular vote would run the danger of near riots in determining the validity of very close elections or determining the POTUS if their are three or more nearly equal candidates. But much of the objections to the EC are actually objections to the WTA system.


Yes. Most rational human beings understand that the sun is green, as well.

I don't think you can raise the specter of riots as an excuse to make elections unfair. Particularly today, it's easy to verify the results of elections. It might not have been 200 years ago.

The real flaw in the EC system is that the voters don't need representatives--electors--to make their will known. It's quite simple to just tally up all the popular votes and see who got the most--nationwide. The Republicans love the EC because it enables them to manipulate elections. It's worked for them twice, after all, causing the candidate who actually lost to get elected. When a candidate gets 400,000 votes fewer than his closest rival, yet gets well over half the electoral votes, the system is obviously flawed.

And I'm sure that Republicans would be decrying the horrible "rigged" system if Trump had gotten more popular votes but lost the EC.
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