Simple question?

Quote: rxwine

You're still advertising the fantasy mansion property site unseen. Pure hucksterism.

There was a joke in the late 80s of a dialogue between the Pope and Gorbachev. I don't recall how it went, but the punch line was the Pope saying "We didn't let them see our paradise."

Quote: FrGamble

Whoa there Bob I said it was free not cheap. It is the greatest gift you could ever desire and it is something you could never ever afford. .

I don't care about any of that claptrap,
I just want you to admit it's not free.
There are hoops you have to jump thru
involved, things you have to do. And if
it's something I could never afford, you
are doing it a disservice by calling it 'free'.
Calling it that cheapens it's value, like the
free gift you get for being the 50th customer
of the day at a store. You know whatever they
might give you will be crap, because it's free.

If your free gift has so much value, you should
tell people it's very expensive and maybe they
can benefit from it if they work very hard. Saying
it's free when it's not is just a cheap sales trick.

For me and for atheists, it's worth nothing, even
if it was really free. God is very selfish in this
myth. He invents the problem, and then concocts
a solution that makes no sense. I still have no idea
what anybody is getting 'saved' from. The more
you get into it, the less logical sense it makes. It
only makes sense to you because you blindly
accept the parts that the rest of us question. How
nice for you..

Yeah, it is definitely not cheap. Someone paid the ultimate price so you could receive it totally free.

You do know the problem very well, we all do. It is the disconnect between who we are and who we want to be. It is the desire to dream big in us and the innate drive to be more, more loving, joyful, peaceful, wise, and kind.

Quote: Nareed

What will it get you to stop?

Nothing could do that. However I will say the more you show a misunderstanding of what love is and the nature of truth; the more I seem to love and care for you.

Quote: FrGamble

Yeah, it is definitely not cheap. Someone paid the ultimate price

What was the price he paid, exactly. It can't be
death, everybody dies. There were 100K others
that were crucified, his death was far from unique.
So what 'ultimate price' was paid. And as far
as I know, you can't kill a god anyway, so why
even say he died in the myth.


You do know the problem very well, we all do. It is the disconnect between who we are and who we want to be. .

You need help to change who you are, we all do. The greatest help we can receive is the help of God who created you, loves you, and wants what is truly best for you and will most joyfully fulfill you. He frees you from any guilt or shame and is always there to inspire and encourage you to do what is right.

Quote: FrGamble

You need help to change who you are, we all do.

Again, why would I want to change who I
am. I've been working on it for a long
time and am very satisfied with the
result. And you didn't clarify what the
price was that he paid. It can't be death,
we all die. And he was a god, the myth
says. How do you kill a god.

Quote: FrGamble

You need help to change who you are, we all do.

People don't change, "who they are".

Quote: petroglyph

People don't change, "who they are".

This is quite true. I'm still the same person
I was at 20, I've just become more of who
that is. I suspect FrG means change in a
way more pleasing to the Church. He
thinks he means god, but there is no god,
so he really means the Church.

Quote: FrGamble

You need help to change who you are, we all do. The greatest help we can receive is the help of God who created you, loves you, and wants what is truly best for you and will most joyfully fulfill you. He frees you from any guilt or shame and is always there to inspire and encourage you to do what is right.

You know what in praying about this answer I realize how poor it is. Christianity is not some self-help book. It is true that a relationship with Christ will help you become the best version of yourself and fill you with joy. However the real problem for humanity is not so much sin itself but it's consequence, namely death. I'm talking eternal death and complete separation from God. A complete separation from love, hope, and happiness. This is the problem and we can do nothing about it on our own. It is only faith in Jesus Christ who has defeated sin and death that shows us the way to share in this ultimate victory and solves for us the real problem of humanity.