In the News II

Quote: Evenbob

Only if you assume that there's a creator. Take that assumption away and everything changes. Maybe the universe has been here forever but with our limited brains we can't see that. Brain size is everything. When you beat a dog with a broom, when you're not looking the dog will chew on the broom trying to destroy it. His small brain does not make the connection between you and the broom. He thinks the broom is the evil one that's beating him. Humans have large brains that can see a lot more connections than a dog can see. But assuming we can see all the connections is ridiculous. Religion is just a way we fill in the blanks until we learn the truth. Believing everything was created is easy, no more work to do. And if you get a bunch of people to agree with you, it's even easier.

The human brain cannot comprehend that the universe has been here forever. But we are talking the earth only. It has been here about 4.5 billion years. We know that life was not on it for at least the first couple billion. Neither of these points are in dispute. So it becomes about how did life form? You have two problems.

First is any form of life. It is almost certain to hat the first life was some kind of single cell life. But why? How? We have found billion year old rocks that are still rocks. That life was not always here, we know this. It had to be created somehow from somewhere. If you are going to say it was random then I ask where is the life on mercury, Venus, Mars, and Pluto?

Second problem is then where did animals come from and how did sexual reproduction happen? Something had to have caused both. Again random does not explain it. You can say “Mother Nature air you like but that confirms a creator.

Quote: AZDuffman

The human brain cannot comprehend that the universe has been here forever. .

This is all I'm quoting from your post because it's all you need to say. After that there is no argument. We cannot comprehend it so we dismiss it. It's obvious to me that the Universe has been here forever and more and more people in science are jumping on that train. Just because we can't comprehend it doesn't mean it's not valid. This is why there are so many different religions and they all think they're right. Because none of them are right, they don't have enough information for them to be right. Just start out with the premise that the Universe has been here forever and watch all religions completely disappear from the argument.

Quote: AZDuffman

Science disproved spontaneous generation. Some kind of force had to act to create life. Your bigotry makes you blind. Quit being a meathead.

LOL

Put down that bible and smell the science.

I googled "current science about origin of life" and got:

"According to current scientific understanding, life on Earth likely originated through a process called abiogenesis, where simple organic molecules gradually became more complex under the conditions of early Earth, eventually leading to self-replicating structures that could be considered "alive"; however, the exact mechanism is still unknown and remains a subject of ongoing research, with evidence suggesting the first life forms appeared around 3.5 billion years ago, possibly in the form of bacteria-like organisms.?"

This seems consistent with the prevailing view over my life time, but hey, you say that's not what science says?

Please provide source material for your specious claim.

Quote: Evenbob

This is all I'm quoting from your post because it's all you need to say. After that there is no argument. We cannot comprehend it so we dismiss it. It's obvious to me that the Universe has been here forever and more and more people in science are jumping on that train. Just because we can't comprehend it doesn't mean it's not valid. This is why there are so many different religions and they all think they're right. Because none of them are right, they don't have enough information for them to be right. Just start out with the premise that the Universe has been here forever and watch all religions completely disappear from the argument.

The problem of "it has been here forever" is this cannot be true as if it was gravity would have attracted everything to everything and it would be all one collapsed neutron star-like mass.

Quote: missedhervee

LOL

Put down that bible and smell the science.

I googled "current science about origin of life" and got:

"According to current scientific understanding, life on Earth likely originated through a process called abiogenesis, where simple organic molecules gradually became more complex under the conditions of early Earth, eventually leading to self-replicating structures that could be considered "alive"; however, the exact mechanism is still unknown and remains a subject of ongoing research, with evidence suggesting the first life forms appeared around 3.5 billion years ago, possibly in the form of bacteria-like organisms.?"

This seems consistent with the prevailing view over my life time, but hey, you say that's not what science says?

Please provide source material for your specious claim.

And that is where a creator comes in. They could not become more complex on their own. An outside force had to cause it. 1 billion years with no life then all of the sudden, life? But not on any other planets. No scientist who calls himself a scientist would rule a creator out totally, unless they have an agenda.

Quote: AZDuffman

The problem of "it has been here forever" is this cannot be true as if it was gravity would have attracted everything to everything and it would be all one collapsed neutron star-like mass.

The problem with theories is they keep building bigger telescopes and discovering things that make their past theories totally obsolete. Like now they now think that the universe itself is far older than they thought it was.

"The universe may be significantly older than previously thought,
with estimates suggesting it could be around 26.7 billion years
old, nearly double the previously accepted age of 13.8 billion
years old."

The problem is we've only discovered a teeny tiny part of what there is to discover so any theories are just that. Waiting to be debunked at any time. One of them is the theory that there's a God. For me that's already been debunked, for others it never will be. Lots of people still believe the Earth is flat. Look at reincarnation. In the last 60 years science has shown that some people do indeed reincarnate into another body. It's undeniable. What does this mean? I don't think it means anything because I don't think anything means anything. It's us that put meaning on things, not the other way around.

Quote: AZDuffman

And that is where a creator comes in. They could not become more complex on their own. An outside force had to cause it. 1 billion years with no life then all of the sudden, life? But not on any other planets. No scientist who calls himself a scientist would rule a creator out totally, unless they have an agenda.

Huh?

Yes they most ceRtainly could have become more complex "on their own"

I agree that it is all a bit murky but lightning flashes hitting chemicals on the ground to form amino acids seems plausible, and from there "it's just a matter of time."

But that first organic form: it could be that there is no life anywhere other than on earth.

Were there a creator and life all over the place then don't you think we'd have seen signs of it with our powerful space examining telescopes and arrays?

Quote: AZDuffman

The problem of "it has been here forever" is this cannot be true as if it was gravity would have attracted everything to everything and it would be all one collapsed neutron star-like mass.

The problem with theories is they keep building bigger telescopes and discovering things that make their past theories totally obsolete. Like now they now think that the universe itself is far older than they thought it was.

"The universe may be significantly older than previously thought,
with estimates suggesting it could be around 26.7 billion years
old, nearly double the previously accepted age of 13.8 billion
years old."

The problem is we've only discovered a teeny tiny part of what there is to discover so any theories are just that. Waiting to be debunked at any time. One of them is the theory that there's a God. For me that's already been debunked, for others it never will be. Lots of people still believe the Earth is flat. Look at reincarnation. In the last 60 years science has shown that some people do indeed reincarnate into another body. It's undeniable. What does this mean? I don't think it means anything because I don't think anything means anything. It's us that put meaning on things, not the other way around.

Quote: Evenbob

Look at reincarnation. In the last 60 years science has shown that some people do indeed reincarnate into another body. It's undeniable. What does this mean?

Really?

I'd love to see the actual, replicated scientific proof of your silly claim that "science has shown that some people do indeed reincarnate into another body."

Quote: missedhervee

Really?

I'd love to see the actual, replicated scientific proof of your silly claim that "science has shown that some people do indeed reincarnate into another body."

https://diversitytomorrow.com/thread/1210/0/