Climate Change -- conspiracy theory or is it time we all drive a Prius?

Quote: rxwine

So do you have some measurement in mind, where you finally say, that’s enough to declare climate change?

I think we have to respect the science and say some kind of climate change is afoot. I'm not too interested in trying to glean much from the weather.

I'll grant you what goes on in the ocean is more pertinent ... the magnitude of the El Niño might be saying something, and OK the strength of this storm you cited is possibly connected to that very definite ocean warming. Umm, even though it's not something new.

Once more, no panic please, and god forbid we jump in to crackpot ideas again. The backlash from that has set us back from accomplishing anything. Germany is burning coal like crazy now , for instance, after nutty ideas there didn't work.

Quote: odiousgambit

I think we have to respect the science and say some kind of climate change is afoot. I'm not too interested in trying to glean much from the weather.

I'll grant you what goes on in the ocean is more pertinent ... the magnitude of the El Niño might be saying something, and OK the strength of this storm you cited is possibly connected to that very definite ocean warming. Umm, even though it's not something new.

Once more, no panic please, and god forbid we jump in to crackpot ideas again. The backlash from that has set us back from accomplishing anything. Germany is burning coal like crazy now , for instance, after nutty ideas there didn't work.

And by “panic” do you mean collectively acknowledging that it’s a problem and taking measures to do something about it, or is anything other than the status quo viewed as panic?

Quote: JimRockford

And by “panic” do you mean collectively acknowledging that it’s a problem and taking measures to do something about it, or is anything other than the status quo viewed as panic?

I feel all the bad ideas that got put into place come from being panicked about climate change.

Europe and Sri Lanka are good examples. The googlebot quickly dished this up:

Failed or Stalled European Climate Solutions

Carbon Capture and Storage (CCS) Subsidies: The EU, its member states, and Norway have poured over €17 billion into public subsidies for CCS and hydrogen. Reports from groups like Oil Change International and Corporate Europe Observatory show that the technology has failed to scale or perform as advertised after decades of research, serving largely as a lifeline for fossil fuel interests rather than an effective emissions reducer.

EU Bioenergy Policies: Classified by environmental groups like the WWF as a major counterproductive policy, EU rules incentivized burning wood biomass and crops for renewable energy. Rather than cutting emissions, this practice often accelerated deforestation and increased atmospheric carbon.

The Common Agricultural Policy (CAP): Large portions of the EU's agricultural subsidies have actively obstructed land restoration and carbon sequestration. The policy rewards intensive farming models and animal product consumption, driving up soil carbon emissions instead of mitigating them.

Stalled Hydrogen and Green Deal Investments: Early ambitious targets under the EU Green Deal aimed to scale up industrial hydrogen projects rapidly. High energy prices, regulatory friction, and a lack of market demand led to widespread project cancellations and postponements.

Flawed Forest and Land-Based Offsets: The EU historically resisted including volatile forest carbon offsets in its Emissions Trading System (ETS) due to manipulation risks. However, subsequent political pushes to revive these offsets through frameworks like the Carbon Removal Certification Framework (CRCF) threatened to reintroduce mechanisms prone to overstating actual climate impact.

Sri Lanka was a real warning to anyone ready to listen to crackpots:

The Overnight 100% Organic Farming Mandate (2021)The Plan: In April 2021, the government under President Gotabaya Rajapaksa implemented an abrupt, nationwide ban on all chemical fertilizers and pesticides. The goal was to combat soil degradation, reduce greenhouse gas emissions from synthetic fertilizers, and position Sri Lanka as the world's first 100% organic farming nation.

Why it Flopped: The transition was forced overnight without training, domestic organic alternatives, or safety nets for farmers. Rice yields plummeted by over 30%, and critical export crops like tea experienced devastating drops. This triggered acute food insecurity, hyperinflation, and a massive economic crisis that ultimately contributed to the historic "People Power" revolution and the collapse of the presidency in 2022. The policy was completely rescinded within six months

Urban Wetland and Flood Retention "Paper Protection"The Plan: Sri Lanka established sweeping climate adaptation policies specifically prioritizing ecosystem and wetland conservation—such as the Muthurajawela Wetlands—to act as natural flood retention zones for urban areas like Colombo.

Why it Flopped: A lack of strict enforcement turned regulations into mere suggestions. The government continuously permitted unregulated urbanization, allowing developers to fill in critical wetlands and build luxury apartments and shopping complexes directly on floodplains. Instead of working as a climate adaptation tool, the compromised wetlands have worsened urban vulnerability, leaving Colombo trapped in a recurring cycle of severe, human-induced flash floods

The Plan: To combat the effects of extreme weather, the government laid out ambitious climate targets and frameworks, including labor migration networks and relocation programs to move vulnerable farming and coastal communities away from high-risk, climate-ravaged zones.

Why it Flopped: Implementation has stalled due to fragmented governance, where overlapping ministries, clashing agencies, and underfunded local councils lack coordinated authority. Millions of vulnerable farmers remain trapped in high-risk zones without structural support. This systemic failure has forced an unstructured, desperate "climate exodus," driving thousands of rural women to migrate abroad to the Middle East for survival as local agriculture collapses.

Okay, so no half baked unfeasible actions. Would you support more reasoned government initiatives? Emissions reduction mandates for power plants, subsidies for renewable energy, aggressive but attainable CAFE standards?

Any reasonable initiatives are fine, it would be nice to be able to quit using fossil fuels where green energy can substitute. I'm an outdoorsman and don't want to be carrying water for polluters. I suspect, for instance, CAFE standards were pushed too hard too fast, so all this stuff needs to be reasoned out. I'm not too crazy about just letting the EPA make these decisions. I think we should have pushed for the switch to hybrids before going full steam ahead on EVs, for instance. We didn't because, well, the panic set in.

You do see that backlash to bad ideas sets us back even further? Not to mention people dying, which certainly happened in Sri Lanka.

A reasonable guy to listen to is Bjorn Lomborg, who agrees that climate change is a problem, but gets concerned over, well, crackpot ideas. He has books, website etc.