Is the future of EV charging bidirectional?

https://www.renewableenergyworld.com/storage/is-the-future-of-ev-charging-bidirectional/

Let's look at some California numbers. Average price of residential electricity is 16.89 cents per kWh. Peak summer capacity is 75,469 Mw. Annual production in 2018 is 201,784,204 mWh and consumption is 250,378,710 mWh (685,969 mWh per day on average or ~17 kWh per person per day).

In the new future each electric vehicle will probably average an 80 kWh battery. At present 80 kWh is a fairly large battery, but the new Ford lightning electric pickup truck will probably have 120 and 160 kWh batteries (they haven't stated the specs yet).


So California is consuming 24% more electricity than it can produce at present, so there is obviously some concern about the effect on the grid of converting 25 million current gasoline powered vehicles to electric vehicles.

But keep in mind that 25 million vehicles with represents a potential stored 2 million mWh of power which is three times the average daily consumption for the entire state,

Everyone knows the issue is not with average power consumption, it is with peaks. If the utility companies could tap into this potential energy source it could handle peak demands much easier.

If bidirectional charging becomes the norm it is possible that California will have fewer blackouts with EVs. The Nissan Leaf could always do bidirectional, but now Tesla might be quietly adding the capability.

Elon has expressed some concern about wearing out the batteries too quickly with bidirectional use.

My gut tells me there will be a few enthusiasts sending the charge back into the grid, of course, but the average person will want to have his car fully charged and ready to go.

Which gets into the idea of the average person. From something I saw I get the idea people are likely going to typically retain a gas burner for longer trips even if they are OK with using EVs for daily use. In northern climes it'll be even more desirable to keep an ICE vehicle in addition to your EV. Meanwhile feeling great about how cool and hip they are for saving the planet, in their own minds. So upper middle class and higher will be happy with the arrangement but for the rest of the population, I dunno

I do not see people draining their EVs back into the grid. Think about it, are you going to let your EV discharge and be empty when you need to use it?

Apparently during the Texas power outage some Tesla owners were using a $200 inverter to get power and heat. Of course, that can void the warranty if found out. It could also end up damaging the electrical system if you don't know what you're doing.

But then those soaring multi-thousand dollar utility bills made such a solution very appealing.

Quote: odiousgambit

My gut tells me there will be a few enthusiasts sending the charge back into the grid, of course, but the average person will want to have his car fully charged and ready to go.

It might go like so:

1. Car battery fully charged in garage in the evening.
2. Car owner goes to an app and pretty much knows he won't be driving over 40 miles the next day at the most.
3. Then the drain is calculated to make sure he has enough charge at 7am in the morning. All automatically calculated.

Car owner gets credit if he does this, but nothing happens if he doesn't plan it, so car remains undischarged for the night.

Quote: rxwine

It might go like so:

1. Car battery fully charged in garage in the evening.
2. Car owner goes to an app and pretty much knows he won't be driving over 40 miles the next day at the most.
3. Then the drain is calculated to make sure he has enough charge at 7am in the morning. All automatically calculated.

Car owner gets credit if he does this, but nothing happens if he doesn't plan it, so car remains undischarged for the night.

Not gonna happen. All you have to do is look at how many people bought how much extra toilet paper in the early days of the china virus. Americans are not going to let their vehicles discharge just to help the grid.

Quote: AZDuffman

Not gonna happen. All you have to do is look at how many people bought how much extra toilet paper in the early days of the china virus. Americans are not going to let their vehicles discharge just to help the grid.

Not sure why you think that. My sister gets credit when solar goes back to the grid. If it doesn't, she doesn't.

Some people use bottle return for deposit. Some ignore. No reason to think no one would use it.

Quote: rxwine

Not sure why you think that. My sister gets credit when solar goes back to the grid. If it doesn't, she doesn't.

Some people use bottle return for deposit. Some ignore. No reason to think no one would use it.

In either case the person is not putting themselves at inconvenience. The solar going to the grid is seamless. Bottle return deposits you have a gain for at the most rinsing out the bottles.

But to let your car drain down to having minimal range? People will not do it. People want the ability to go wherever they want whenever they want.

Now, I guess I need to explain what this means since this board has too many people who cannot accept a general statement. "Generally" people are not going to do it. A few do-gooders will do it, the ones who do anything their government tells them to do. The other 90% are not.

Quote: rxwine

It might go like so:

1. Car battery fully charged in garage in the evening.
2. Car owner goes to an app and pretty much knows he won't be driving over 40 miles the next day at the most.
3. Then the drain is calculated to make sure he has enough charge at 7am in the morning. All automatically calculated.

Car owner gets credit if he does this, but nothing happens if he doesn't plan it, so car remains undischarged for the night.

So after he gets home his daughter calls and is stuck somewhere and not comfortable with the people there. His answer of course is I'm sorry kid I sent my extra power to the grid and got paid $2.00 you will have to tough it out.

Quote: kenarman

So after he gets home his daughter calls and is stuck somewhere and not comfortable with the people there. His answer of course is I'm sorry kid I sent my extra power to the grid and got paid $2.00 you will have to tough it out.

Sure. And you could have one car, and the wife could be somewhere leaving you without emergency access also.