Simple question?

Then don't use words like abnormal to describe human beings. As I just suggested let's use the word healthy or we can extend the use of the word "normal" to be far more inclusive. Anyway, the Church does have strict rules about the Sacrament of Marriage, but it doesn't say those who can't enter into the Sacrament are abnormal or unequal or anything like that.

Quote: FrGamble

Then don't use words like abnormal to describe human beings. As I just suggested let's use the word healthy or we can extend the use of the word "normal" to be far more inclusive. Anyway, the Church does have strict rules about the Sacrament of Marriage, but it doesn't say those who can't enter into the Sacrament are abnormal or unequal or anything like that.

Perhaps not. But as I'm pretty sure Nareed would point out, it doesn't have to. Kind of like a "White's only" sign is pretty much "No N*****s allowed" even if it doesn't say the second thing.

Quote: FrGamble

Skin color is well...skin deep.

No. Skin color is culturally deep, not skin
deep. When I drove a cab in a black
neighborhood to pick up a fare, I was on
high alert. These were not White people
with dark skin. These were people with
dark skin who live in a sub culture within
out culture where White people are often
not welcome at all. To put is mildly.

Saying skin color is skin deep is missing
98% of the equation. You'd be dead in
a week driving a cab with that attitude.

Quote: Evenbob

No. Skin color is culturally deep, not skin
deep. When I drove a cab in a black
neighborhood to pick up a fare, I was on
high alert. These were not White people
with dark skin. These were people with
dark skin who live in a sub culture within
out culture where White people are often
not welcome at all. To put is mildly.

Saying skin color is skin deep is missing
98% of the equation. You'd be dead in
a week driving a cab with that attitude.

White people get killed by Aryan skinheads, and white motorcycle gangs. They also kill each other.

10 years from now you could be talking on the phone to Mitt Romney's black grandchild and you won't know she's black she'll probably sound more cultured and whiter than you.

What's color have to do with it? Culture has something to do with it. Color is just a bs reason for blame. I know what you're saying as far as being in a bad neighborhood, but color isn't the cause.

Quote: FrGamble

Skin color is well...skin deep. Saying that your skin color makes a huge difference in what you are able to do or who you are is prejudice.

I'm not talking about skin color, but about the effects of skin color in a still-racist society.

White parents are more likely to have and/or make connections to help their adopted child later on in life. They're less likely to be killed in a violent altercation. they're less likely to be imprisoned, too.

Now, I would think even if we disregard material advantages, having the parents actually around would be more helpful to the child.

Is this racist and discriminatory? HELL, YES IT IS!

Your position is homophobic and discriminatory. And you're completely ok with it.

Careful you don't poke someone's eye out with that beam, ok?

Quote: rxwine

I think what bothers me in particular, is supposedly you're doing it from a position that is otherwise suppose to be revered for morality, and love, and supposedly good things. But you've adopted a trait of some of the worse bigotry in this particular respect.

I think this all goes to the principle that an action can be separated from the person performing that action. You know, the old trope "hate the sin but love the sinner"?

So we get the idea that LGBT people are "equal" but their intimate relations are not, their unions are not, and special discriminatory strictures are placed on them as a result. It's not that they can't be good parents, it's that they shouldn't be parents at all. But they're completely equal. If they do what all straight couples do, they'll go to hell. But they're equal. If they want to formalize their union, they can't because the church doesn't offer that kind of recognition. But they're equal.

Just not as equal as others.

Quote: Nareed

I'm not talking about skin color, but about the effects of skin color in a still-racist society.

White parents are more likely to have and/or make connections to help their adopted child later on in life. They're less likely to be killed in a violent altercation. they're less likely to be imprisoned, too.

Now, I would think even if we disregard material advantages, having the parents actually around would be more helpful to the child.

Is this racist and discriminatory? HELL, YES IT IS!

Your position is homophobic and discriminatory. And you're completely ok with it.

Careful you don't poke someone's eye out with that beam, ok?

Your comments about whites and blacks is discrimination. It is all circumstancial and projections that are far from always true. I know you are trying to make a poor point and don't believe that craps, but it doesn't come close to being pertinent to our discussion.

Men are men and women are women. You don't need statistics to try and predict that. They both contribute their unique gifts to the raising of children. The are complimentary and are naturally set up not only to raise a child but create one as well.

I no doubt have a beam in my eye, but I'm afraid you have gone blind.

Quote: Nareed

I think this all goes to the principle that an action can be separated from the person performing that action. You know, the old trope "hate the sin but love the sinner"?

So we get the idea that LGBT people are "equal" but their intimate relations are not, their unions are not, and special discriminatory strictures are placed on them as a result. It's not that they can't be good parents, it's that they shouldn't be parents at all. But they're completely equal. If they do what all straight couples do, they'll go to hell. But they're equal. If they want to formalize their union, they can't because the church doesn't offer that kind of recognition. But they're equal.

Just not as equal as others.

Why cannot you not see that things can be different and equal! And please don't bring out the whole "seperate but equal" phrase because it is offensive to those who have and continue to suffer from racism. Why do you think everyone and everything has to the same and called the same thing to be equal?

Quote: rxwine

What we don't do is force them to do anything they don't want to do. If someone doesn't want a medical or psychiatric treatment to become more like the so-called "normal" person, we don't force them to do anything even if we have a treatment.

I wish that were entirely true.

Many intersex children, and children with other genital abnormalities, undergo irreversible surgeries shortly after birth to "normalize" their appearance. It's hard to say what the overall long-term consequences are, as there's little follow-up. But there are many horror stories concerning what happens when some of these children grow up and their gender identity doesn't match the one that was forced on them.

What's worse is none of them were ever consulted. Now, it's true you cannot consult a newborn. But there's no rush or hurry to operate. It's not a life-threatening condition, or even one involving any major functions (like walking, eating, sleeping, etc.) It can, and should, wait until the child develops their own identity and can be taken into account.

Quote: FrGamble

Why cannot you not see that things can be different and equal!

Because unequal treatment is not equal.

You have a right to be misogynistic and homophobic, and you'll even be protected by the government. But stop trying to pretend you're not.