Chauvin trial

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April 15th, 2021 at 9:16:46 AM permalink
SOOPOO
Member since: Feb 19, 2014
Threads: 22
Posts: 4126
Watched most of it with wife. Well, most of it while not on golf course so a few 5 hour gaps....

My vote if I was on the jury

2nd degree murder. Not guilty
3rd degree murder. Probably guilty. Still need to hear closing arguments though.
2nd degree manslaughter. If not guilty of murder, then definitely guilty of 2nd degree manslaughter.

Whatever the result, I expect more billions of dollars in rioting and looting as a result.

If by some chance he is found not guilty I would expect violence directed at the defendant, his counsel, jurors, etc...
April 15th, 2021 at 9:36:17 AM permalink
ams288
Member since: Apr 21, 2016
Threads: 29
Posts: 12326
I haven’t watched much of the coverage at all.

But I gotta agree - if he doesn’t end up rotting in prison, Minneapolis is going to get burned to the ground.
“A straight man will not go for kids.” - AZDuffman
April 15th, 2021 at 10:10:44 AM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 187
Posts: 18445
While I could buy that a person could be lying about .not being able to breathe in order to free up some restraint, once the person goes silent or limp, the people restraining that person have an obligation to start using measures to make sure the person is alive. That’s just pure negligence, and in this case negligent homicide, or worse depending on the training.
You believe in an invisible god, and dismiss people who say they are trans? Really?
April 15th, 2021 at 12:05:59 PM permalink
SOOPOO
Member since: Feb 19, 2014
Threads: 22
Posts: 4126
Quote: rxwine
While I could buy that a person could be lying about .not being able to breathe in order to free up some restraint, once the person goes silent or limp, the people restraining that person have an obligation to start using measures to make sure the person is alive. That’s just pure negligence, and in this case negligent homicide, or worse depending on the training.


Minnesota uses the three possible crimes I mentioned, not ‘negligent homicide’. Both 3rd degree murder and 2nd degree manslaughter might fit your definition. Google them, with ‘Minnesota’, then decide.

Since ‘reasonable doubt’ is in play, I now have decided I vote guilty on 2nd degree manslaughter. Meaning he is probably guilty of 3rd degree murder, but not beyond a reasonable doubt.
April 15th, 2021 at 12:43:49 PM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 187
Posts: 18445
I wouldn't mind seeing police have more tools to convince a potential fugitive of a non-violent offense to just turn themselves in. That's where things like property confiscation might come into play. Even if the person is staying with someone, they ought to be able to give a warning to that person that he could end up being charged, fined, or have his car confiscated caught driving the wanted person around.

Even if the fugitive has nothing of value the people around him are going be discouraged from supporting him.
You believe in an invisible god, and dismiss people who say they are trans? Really?
April 15th, 2021 at 12:50:52 PM permalink
terapined
Member since: Aug 6, 2014
Threads: 73
Posts: 11781
Quote: rxwine
I wouldn't mind seeing police have more tools to convince a potential fugitive of a non-violent offense to just turn themselves in. That's where things like property confiscation might come into play. Even if the person is staying with someone, they ought to be able to give a warning to that person that he could end up being charged, fined, or have his car confiscated caught driving the wanted person around.

Even if the fugitive has nothing of value the people around him are going be discouraged from supporting him.

Too many cops escalate because they have toys they want to use and they are on power trips.
A professional law enforcement officer tries to descalate
Sometimes we live no particular way but our own - Grateful Dead "Eyes of the World"
April 15th, 2021 at 12:58:53 PM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 187
Posts: 18445
Quote: terapined
Too many cops escalate because they have toys they want to use and they are on power trips.
A professional law enforcement officer tries to descalate


Once you have someone unwilling to go into custody who has done something non-violent, and for instance insists on running away, you should have other options.

Of course it depends on a few other things, like if you have a positive identity and whether any other threats have been made.
You believe in an invisible god, and dismiss people who say they are trans? Really?
April 15th, 2021 at 2:09:12 PM permalink
JCW09
Member since: Aug 27, 2018
Threads: 12
Posts: 847
Second degree murder is a hard no, they never came close to convincing anyone of that trumped up charge.

609.195 MURDER IN THE THIRD DEGREE.
(a) Whoever, without intent to effect the death of any person, causes the death of another by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life, is guilty of murder in the third degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 25 years.

The above relates to acts like shooting into a crowd, driving a car onto a crowded sidewalk.
This is the depraved heart crime where you didn't intend to kill anyone specifically but knew your actions would likely kill someone.
And you were right and you did in fact kill someone.
This charge doesn't even fit the case and its a mystery why the judge let it back in to the list of charges.

609.205 Manslaughter in the Second Degree
A person who causes the death of another by any of the following means is guilty of manslaughter in the second degree :
(1) by the person's culpable negligence whereby the person creates an unreasonable risk, and consciously takes chances of causing death or great bodily harm to another; or

You have to prove cupable negligence (I think the prosecution gets over this hurdle) but creating an unreasonable risk and consciously takes chances of causing death (I think the prosecution has failed this hurdle). I don't think the prosecution has proved the case that a man without being high on fentanyl, having a 90% blockage in his coronary artery would have died in the same circumstances or that Chauvin should have known what he was doing would cause death or great bodily harm and he consciously decided to take those actions knowing death to be a likely outcome.

My prediction is hung jury & city burning to the groud.
So be it, if you live in a Democrat City that wants to Defund the Police, I say let it burn.
The Left wants mob rule, let the mob rule Minneapolis and see how that works for them.
Def. of Liar - "A Person Who Tells Lies" / "I lied. Deal with it" - ams288
April 15th, 2021 at 2:10:00 PM permalink
JCW09
Member since: Aug 27, 2018
Threads: 12
Posts: 847
Quote: terapined
Too many cops escalate because they have toys they want to use and they are on power trips.
A professional law enforcement officer tries to descalate

And once again, you don't know WTF you are talking about.
Surprising no one here.
Def. of Liar - "A Person Who Tells Lies" / "I lied. Deal with it" - ams288
April 15th, 2021 at 2:46:02 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18136
Quote: JCW09


My prediction is hung jury & city burning to the groud.
So be it, if you live in a Democrat City that wants to Defund the Police, I say let it burn.
The Left wants mob rule, let the mob rule Minneapolis and see how that works for them.


BURN, BABY, BURN! Then let them live in it!
The President is a fink.
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