Gigafactory

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February 2nd, 2021 at 5:03:28 AM permalink
DRich
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 51
Posts: 4969
Quote: SOOPOO
Quote: DRich
Quote: AZDuffman
Tesla Racks Up Another Record Year (and Another Loss)

More than all of TSLA quarterly profit made from selling EV credits? As well as half of free cash flow?

This company keeps looking more and more like Enron or Texas Air. Where is that Bethany McKee or McGee who called out Enron when everyone else kept yelling BUY BUY BUY!?


My guess is at some point Tesla will file for bankruptcy and then come out of it a strong company that mainly sells batteries to other manufacturers.


I haven’t looked at this thread for a year! Your guess has not panned out as of now.


This is why I am a terrible investor. Thankfully I don't have a margin account otherwise I would have shorted Tesla and Gamestop.
At my age a Life In Prison sentence is not much of a detrrent.
March 28th, 2021 at 12:16:12 PM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 189
Posts: 18762
Imagine your electric vehicle without the battery.
Then imagine using the structural frame as the battery and never adding most of the big battery pack.

Quote:
Scientist at the Swedish university say they’ve put together a structural battery that has 10 times the performance of previous versions. It’s made of carbon fibre, which serves as the battery’s electrode, conductor, and load-bearing material. This clever engineering means the battery can serve as a stressed member of the chassis—or as the chassis itself.
You believe in an invisible god, and dismiss people who say they are trans? Really?
April 14th, 2021 at 10:30:35 AM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 189
Posts: 18762
Apparently, there are a lot of new permits being requested for green energy downtime storage using this:


Quote:
Unlike the many newfangled energy storage schemes out there, pumped storage hydro has been around for a long time. In fact, in 1929, Popular Science covered the country’s first such plant, a “10-mile storage battery” just off the Housatonic River in New Milford, Connecticut. The author marveled that the plant, still in operation today, could store more energy than all the automobile batteries in the country at the time.
You believe in an invisible god, and dismiss people who say they are trans? Really?
April 14th, 2021 at 8:15:36 PM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: DRich
This is why I am a terrible investor. Thankfully I don't have a margin account otherwise I would have shorted Tesla and Gamestop.


The MSRP on the Teslas are pretty high. Are the sales of these Teslas coming out of existing luxury vehicle sales or they just added on?

$37,990 Tesla Model 3 Standard Range Plus 263 mile range
$46,990 Tesla Model 3 Long Range 353
$55,990 Tesla Model 3 Performance 315
$49,990 Tesla Model Y Long Range 326
$60,990 Tesla Model Y Performance 303
$79,990 Tesla Model S Long Range 412
$79,990 Tesla Model X Long Range 371
$91,990 Tesla Model S Performance 387
$99,990 Tesla Model X Performance 341

Eventually the big Asian car manufacturers (Toyota is jumping in this year, Honda Killed Clarity EV but is working with GM) will produce BEV with the same range for a lot less money. Will the allure of Tesla diminish?

$33,045 Hyundai IONIQ Electric 170 mile range
$36,450 Hyundai Kona Electric 258
$39,990 Kia Niro Electric 239
$29,990 Nissan LEAF S 150
$36,550 Nissan LEAF S PLUS 226

Number of registrations of BEV in the US in 2020: (Tesla has 80% of market)
95,135 Tesla Model 3
71,344 Tesla Model Y
19,652 Tesla Model X
14,430 Tesla Model S
200,561

19,664 Chevrolet Bolt EV
8,972 Nissan LEAF
7,089 Audi e-tron
3,943 Porsche Taycan
2,964 Hyundai Kona Electric
2,807 Kia Niro EV
1,148 other
46,587
April 15th, 2021 at 2:19:48 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18212
Quote: Pacomartin


Eventually the big Asian car manufacturers (Toyota is jumping in this year, Honda Killed Clarity EV but is working with GM) will produce BEV with the same range for a lot less money. Will the allure of Tesla diminish?


We will in the next few years find if the demand is for an EV or for a Tesla. I really think they are overestimating the demand for EVs. GM has decided it loves government regulations now what with them pushing Biden for more subsidies of these things. Like Obamacare, so great they have to force people to buy them......
The President is a fink.
April 15th, 2021 at 5:23:57 PM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: AZDuffman
We will in the next few years find if the demand is for an EV or for a Tesla.


Tesla really is a rich person's toy car. They make a big deal two year of having a model for $35K, but they have discontinued it and only have the $38K model. That one really isn't selling very well, so the actual starting price is $47K.

Toyota, the best selling brand in North America, has only 4 models that start at over $47K, and they sell in very small numbers. They are finally introducing a battery electric vehicle this year. I am curious as to the price they come up with and what kind of market penetration they will have. Up until now they have stated that their resources are better spent introducing hybrid models. They are much more affordable and will have a greater impact on air quality than a small number of BEVs.

Quote: The Tesla Team February 28, 2019

$35,000 Tesla Model 3 Available Now
We are incredibly excited to announce that the standard Model 3, with 220 miles of range, a top speed of 130 mph and 0-60 mph acceleration of 5.6 seconds is now available at $35,000! Although lower in cost, it is built to achieve the same perfect 5-star safety rating as the longer-ranged version, which has the lowest probability of injury of any car ever tested by the U.S. Government.

In addition, we are introducing the Model 3 Standard Range Plus, which offers 240 miles of range, a top speed of 140 mph, 0-60 mph acceleration of just 5.3 seconds and most premium interior features at $37,000 before incentives. For 6% more money, you get 9% more range, more power, and an upgraded interior.

To achieve these prices while remaining financially sustainable, Tesla is shifting sales worldwide to online only. You can now buy a Tesla in North America via your phone in about 1 minute, and that capability will soon be extended worldwide. We are also making it much easier to try out and return a Tesla, so that a test drive prior to purchase isn’t needed. You can now return a car within 7 days or 1,000 miles for a full refund. Quite literally, you could buy a Tesla, drive several hundred miles for a weekend road trip with friends and then return it for free. With the highest consumer satisfaction score of any car on the road, we are confident you will want to keep your Tesla.


$37,990 Tesla Model 3 Standard Range+ 263 mil range
$46,990 Tesla Model 3 Long Range 353
$55,990 Tesla Model 3 Performance 315
$49,990 Tesla Model Y Long Range 326
$60,990 Tesla Model Y Performance 303
$79,990 Tesla Model S Long Range 412
$91,990 Tesla Model S Performance 387
$79,990 Tesla Model X Long Range 371
$99,990 Tesla Model X Performance 341
April 16th, 2021 at 2:31:07 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18212
Quote: Pacomartin
Tesla really is a rich person's toy car. They make a big deal two year of having a model for $35K, but they have discontinued it and only have the $38K model. That one really isn't selling very well, so the actual starting price is $47K.

Toyota, the best selling brand in North America, has only 4 models that start at over $47K, and they sell in very small numbers. They are finally introducing a battery electric vehicle this year. I am curious as to the price they come up with and what kind of market penetration they will have. Up until now they have stated that their resources are better spent introducing hybrid models. They are much more affordable and will have a greater impact on air quality than a small number of BEVs.



IIRC BMW used to say that EVs were just a stepping stone until hydrogen was ready. I still say if they are so good why are we forcing people to buy them by law?

I was right when I said autonomous vehicles were being way, way oversold the past few years. I even wrote in to "Autoline" suggesting they be more like journalists and less like cheerleaders for that tech, boy the host was upset in his return email. Now a few years later they report that the tech is not going to be as promised! Well, yeah! Anyone thoughtful can see the simple hurdles to overcome. Almost as if the "smartest guys" see that they can program this and that but miss the simple such as what happens when two AVs meet at an intersection and do not know who goes first?

I also asked them why are they wanting cars with no controls? How do you move a car a few feet forward in the driveway? How does a mechanic properly road test it? They do not even understand that kind of question. Just "the tech, the tech, the tech!"

There is a C Store near me putting in Tesla chargers. Will these match up to everyone else's EV? What will happen when they realize there is nowhere near enough room to charge all these EVs at stations? And I cannot wait until the shortages for the rare earths the batteries need.
The President is a fink.
April 16th, 2021 at 3:38:56 AM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Quote: AZDuffman
I was right when I said autonomous vehicles were being way, way oversold the past few years. I even wrote in to "Autoline" suggesting they be more like journalists and less like cheerleaders for that tech, boy the host was upset in his return email.


The autonomous taxis that they are testing in Arizona only go on roads with speed limits of 45 mph or less.I think they have a strong future for this market. Children without driver's licenses, the inebriated, the elderly who may only go out once or twice a week, food delivery, etc. But most people under the age of 70 and over age 18 will not be happy with this as the only option.
April 16th, 2021 at 4:01:13 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 18212
Quote: Pacomartin
The autonomous taxis that they are testing in Arizona only go on roads with speed limits of 45 mph or less.I think they have a strong future for this market. Children without driver's licenses, the inebriated, the elderly who may only go out once or twice a week, food delivery, etc. But most people under the age of 70 and over age 18 will not be happy with this as the only option.


It is not going to work like they think it will work. Maybe in two generations. I will be dead by age 70 so that part likely will not matter to me.
The President is a fink.
April 16th, 2021 at 4:06:19 AM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1068
Posts: 12569
Toyota is succumbing to pressure to make a BEV. Tesla's success is getting to be to obvious.

They will release a BEV under the Toyota line and a second one under the Lexus line sometime this year. We will see if their 20 years of experience with hybrids allows them to produce a better BEV.

There are some analysts that wonder if they will surprise people and come out with a hybrid version of one of their largest SUV, the 4 Runner. The Highlander could have a hybrid and BEV version.

2021 Toyota Highlander/Curb weight 4,145 to 4,450 lbs (hybrid available)
2021 Toyota 4Runner/Curb weight 4,400 to 4,805 lbs (no hybrid available at present)

Another possibility is one their two pickups, the Tacoma and the Tundra. Electric pickup trucks have been rumored for some time
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