Nancy Reagan -- RIP

Quote: terapined

Meaningless
We are discussing his 2nd term, not 1st

LOL! You think 1987 was in his first term?
He gave this speech 18 months before
he left office. As I've said before, you know
nothing and think you know everything.

Even better, here's a speech he gave one
month before leaving office. Does he
look or sound sick to you? People with
Alzheimers can't do this.

Quote: Evenbob

LOL! You think 1987 was in his first term?
He gave this speech 18 months before
he left office. As I've said before, you know
nothing and think you know everything.

Rudeness does not win the argument. And yes, Ron and Patti Reagan both have talked about how his mental capacity was impaired during his second term, as have several of his close aides. However, Republicans have chosen to venerate him, so that discussion has largely been buried the last 16 years or so as his memory has been rehabilitated. You can go back to his last several press conferences and see Nancy prompting him, right by his side, and his aides taking him away from casual or impromptu questions in other cases. You also see a lot more briefings from Baker and Rumsfeldt than you would expect, given the subject matters they were covering, if you look for them. They managed him most carefully.

Quote: beachbumbabs

Rudeness does not win the argument.

He wasn't being rude, he was making a point. You clearly made the mistake of when you thought the "Tear Down This Wall" speech was made.

Quote: beachbumbabs

And yes, Ron and Patti Reagan both have talked about how his mental capacity was impaired .

He didn't have Alzheimer's yet. I've been
around people with early stage Alzheimer's.
They get easily confused, they would never
be able to give a speech like the one he
gave a month from leaving office. He's
never confused, never misses a beat. If
he was sick, he would have lost his place
many many times.

And Ron and Patti hated their father, for
various reasons. They have both delighted
in smearing him since he left office and
especially since he died. They have both
profited greatly from cutting him into
pieces. Their word, as far as he's concerned,
means nothing.

Quote: AZDuffman

I may be too tuned out of pop-culture to notice, but I see less concern than there was for coke in the early-1980s. My take is H is far more dangerous to use.

I wish I could have the benefits of coke without the drawbacks.

Richard Pryor coined a saying , [for humors sake] "coke will make a new man out of you, the problem then is...the new man wants some". Amen.

Evidence of the H trade is in the links, if you have trouble sleeping some night : )

The "s" drug you mention is called "sub" or subox/suboxone, which is a trade name for bupranorphine. Where methadone is nearly equivalent to heroin, "bupe" is said to be about 40 times stronger than morphine. An addict with a 3+ gram a day habit of heroin can control it with 2-8 mg's of sub.

OT but IIRC, Romney owned either a methadone or sub clinic? It takes a special dr. to even prescribe it.

People take a long time and a lot of drugs to build that kind of tolerance level, and I don't see "sub" as a party drug, but maybe? I have heard it can help people function and get their lives back.

Withdrawls from coke are nothing, compared to opiates, imo. Entire nations [China] can be overtaken with opiates. The destroyer of worlds. I have a little admiration for people that can use coke socially and not let if become addictive. I am not that guy. I finally tried it after everyone else did, and I liked it. I can't tempt myself that way. I can't imagine how addictive meth is and am glad I never ran into it growing up.

Unbelievable how painful detoxing from a large dosage dependency on opiates is unless you have witnessed it up close and personal. I think if it would be more effective stopping narcotic addiction if it were treated as a disease. Right now it is a revolving door for the private prison industry. Two trillion later, and how many lives lost, the war on drugs isn't working.

Quote: petroglyph

the war on drugs isn't working.

It's not handled correctly. In the late
40's China was a nation of addicts.
Mao came in and made dealing
or using drugs a capital crime, which
meant the death penalty. Guess
what, a few years later no more drugs
in China. Right now, Singapore, in
Malaysia, has the strictest drug laws
in the world. Prison for the tiniest
amount found on your person or
on your property. The death penalty
for dealing or having a large amount.
The result? Singapore is 99.9% drug
free.

At one time, Japan had the death
penalty for any crime you were convicted
of. Steal a loaf of bread? They beheaded
you the day after the trial. The result?
An almost crime free Japan.

Quote: AZDuffman

He wasn't being rude, he was making a point. You clearly made the mistake of when you thought the "Tear Down This Wall" speech was made.

I knew exactly when he made that speech. Perhaps ( or "clearly") you're mistaking me for terapined.

You think a guy trained as a radio announcer, then an actor, then a politician, working for decades, suddenly can't read a teleprompter? It's a long way from giving a prepared speech to being able to have unstructured conversations or cogent thought on complex problems. Tell me he WROTE it, and I'll laugh out loud, because you and I know he didn't (PeggyNoonan).

What is it that makes it impossible for you to think he had any weaknesses? He had many, and declining mental faculties was just one of them. Not a criticism - just a reality check on a human person.

Quote: petroglyph

Unbelievable how painful detoxing from a large dosage dependency on opiates is unless you have witnessed it up close and personal. I think if it would be more effective stopping narcotic addiction if it were treated as a disease. Right now it is a revolving door for the private prison industry. Two trillion later, and how many lives lost, the war on drugs isn't working.

I have sort of said it here before. I am at the point of favoring decriminalization not because I think it is a good idea but I am tired of the fight and getting scared of law enforcement with military equipment.

But what is the answer? As you pointed out, addiction can and will put a nation on its knees for several generations. Too many people like doing the stuff. Hard for me to sympathize because I do not care for recreational use. Never have. But enough do to be a problem.

"Treatment" is after the fact, does not stop people in the first place. Locking them up just locks them up.

Quote: Evenbob

It's not handled correctly.

It never was about getting rid of drugs, it is about control. Getting rid of narcotics wouldn't be that hard. Like Carlin said, "they don't want an educated public capable of critical thinking".

Quote:

In the late
40's China was a nation of addicts.
Mao came in and made dealing
or using drugs a capital crime, which
meant the death penalty.

He also execute 40-60 million Christians.

Quote:

At one time, Japan had the death
penalty for any crime you were convicted
of. Steal a loaf of bread? They beheaded
you the day after the trial. The result?
An almost crime free Japan.

Saudi Arabia "removes the offending appendage" for stealing. My parents worked there in the late 70's and said, you never see one handed people. They go over the hill and die from shame.

Quote: beachbumbabs

I knew exactly when he made that speech. Perhaps ( or "clearly") you're mistaking me for terapined.

Apology here, I read Bob's reply by in your post and mixed them up. I should not have based on you lived thru the era and terapined has a history of recollecting pre-2000 from more history than living it. In any case, EB was not being rude.

Quote:

You think a guy trained as a radio announcer, then an actor, then a politician, working for decades, suddenly can't read a teleprompter? It's a long way from giving a prepared speech to being able to have unstructured conversations or cogent thought on complex problems. Tell me he WROTE it, and I'll laugh out loud, because you and I know he didn't (PeggyNoonan).

What is it that makes it impossible for you to think he had any weaknesses? He had many, and declining mental faculties was just one of them. Not a criticism - just a reality check on a human person.

Peggy might have written it, but Ron had the idea for it. His advisers tried to talk him out of saying it. He demanded it be in. He drove for the destruction of the USSR right until the end, not a sign of a mupppet.

I can think he had weaknesses. What I am tired of is the decades-long MO of liberals trying to make prominent conservatives look stupid and at the same time say liberals are mega-intelligent.