The City on Fire

Quote: SOOPOO

Lots of thinking about the Buffalo guy. He was actively, intentionally, violating a lawfully imposed curfew by the duly elected Democrat African-American mayor of Buffalo. Instead of walking away from the police, he chose to walk towards them. It was not an accident. The police were advancing with their shields and batons out in plain view. He intentionally walked directly at them. There can be no disputing these facts.

I spoke today with a cop (lady, kind of like an SVU cop) and a beat cop, recently retired to open a plumbing business. He said the cops were following protocol to a T. They were advancing with either baton out parallel to the ground, or with a shield if they had one. They gave multiple commands to leave the area, with time spaced between each command. Whatever the guy wanted to say to the police, it was clearly not the time. As far as the amount of force used, he said it seemed reasonable, but just that the guy fell awkwardly. The 57 other riot squad officers who resigned in solidarity with the two suspended officers obviously agree. Interestingly, had they chosen to ignore him and let him to stay illegally, imagine the uproar that they let the white guy stay but forced the black guys out.
As far as the horrible 'optics' of just walking by him while he was unconscious bleeding on the ground, he said if you are in the front row you keep going forward, and those behind you are responsible for an injured guy like that. That is what happened. It was only a few more seconds that you see some supervisor guy calling for a medic. It still looks horrible.

No one will ever ask this question, but is the one I want answered. "Why were you that freaking STUPID to walk towards the cops, who were advancing with shields and batons, while you were breaking curfew and it was clear they were doing their job to enforce that curfew?"

Did the cops use more force than was necessary to move the guy out? In retrospect, obviously yes. At the time? Just a guess. I hate that these two cops will probably lose their jobs over this incident. At least the guy supposedly is doing well.

For whatever it is worth, both of my cop friends say that Chauvin is as guilty as can be. But in the real world, the two rookie cops had no ability to stop him. They were probationary and Chauvin was their supervisor. I think those 3 extra cops are a touchy subject. Probably exactly what the protesters want changed. They want ANY cop to be able to do what is right, regardless of the Blue Wall.

Quote: Gandler

Exactly. 100% .

They pushed him. How often do riot squads push people (all of the time), their job is to clear the street..... People are acting like they abused him in some way, they treated him like anyone else. He is a professional political activist, he has been doing this for decades, he wanted to make a scene, and he got what he wanted..... Police did nothing wrong. If he was too medically fragile he should not charge a riot squad.

Quote: rxwine

I'd like to know what their orders were.

Were they really told, regardless of what you observe keep pushing through. IMO, The situation didn't require an all or nothing response like might be required in an already violent situation.

Suppose the guy had a baby strapped on his back in a papoose that the officers couldn't see? This is not an enemy combatant. Officers should be allowed to stop and render aid.

Just my opinion though.

Quote: AZDuffman

Your opinion shows you have no police training. Ever hear "you don't leave your wingman?"

I have to say I file it under the same as that guy who got slugged because he charged the stage to make a disruption at a Trump rally. If you do not want this to happen, don't block the cops. He crossed out of being a "peaceful protestor" to an "agitator."

Quote: rxwine

I'd like to know what their orders were.

Were they really told, regardless of what you observe keep pushing through. IMO, The situation didn't require an all or nothing response like might be required in an already violent situation.

Suppose the guy had a baby strapped on his back in a papoose that the officers couldn't see? This is not an enemy combatant. Officers should be allowed to stop and render aid.

Just my opinion though.

Quote: rxwine

I'd like to know what their orders were.

Were they really told, regardless of what you observe keep pushing through. IMO, The situation didn't require an all or nothing response like might be required in an already violent situation.

Suppose the guy had a baby strapped on his back in a papoose that the officers couldn't see? This is not an enemy combatant. Officers should be allowed to stop and render aid.

Just my opinion though.

Quote: SOOPOO

It is hard to imagine them keeping their jobs, even if found not guilty in court.

Quote: ams288

Good. Some people shouldn’t be cops.