King Ethanol Will Abdicate?

Quote: odiousgambit

Did I mention btw that I am now able to buy ethanol free gas? And certainly do. For mowers, etc, it is absolutely the only way to go. But I buy it for my vehicles too, which makes my mechanic smile.



http://pure-gas.org/

Nice but too bad the Feds still require other additives.

I heard marinas are usually ethanol free.

Finding anything to replace fuel as we have used won't be easy and nothing will ever be as good or easy. Ethanol being a fraud doesn't change this need for something to replace it. The easiest answer will be radical space exploration to get the mother load we already know is out there if we can overcome the obvious obstacles.

Quote: 1nickelmiracle

Finding anything to replace fuel as we have used won't be easy and nothing will ever be as good or easy. Ethanol being a fraud doesn't change this need for something to replace it. The easiest answer will be radical space exploration to get the mother load we already know is out there if we can overcome the obvious obstacles.

Mother load in space? Well, there's a belt of anti-matter around the Earth.

https://www.google.com/#q=antimatter+belt+around+earth

In the pink there.

Quote: 1nickelmiracle

Finding anything to replace fuel as we have used won't be easy and nothing will ever be as good or easy. Ethanol being a fraud doesn't change this need for something to replace it. The easiest answer will be radical space exploration to get the mother load we already know is out there if we can overcome the obvious obstacles.

If we can ever figure it out, we will be able to produce oil ourselves. Based on some observations it may be possible to pump Carbon deep, deep in the earth where the pressure could form it into long chains with hydrogen and get oil. If we get over our infatuation with subsidizing electric cars then we might be able to do this within 100 years. Such a timeframe makes it hard because you need to essentially get old men to plant trees under who's shade they will never see.

Both the energy equations and chemistry dictate against that happening, with oil as an energy source being totally supplanted. Perhaps the technology doesn't yet exist or it will very likely be solar/hydrogen/electrical(battery) mix.

Quote: chickenman

Both the energy equations and chemistry dictate against that happening, with oil as an energy source being totally supplanted. Perhaps the technology doesn't yet exist or it will very likely be solar/hydrogen/electrical(battery) mix.

Oil is a great energy source because you get like 10 times the energy out of it as you put into the drilling to begin with. Solar does not have this and electrical requires several massive breakthrus. We have 100 years of oil as it is, if we develop this "planting" tech then wile it may take 100 years to "seed an oilfield" the supply becomes near limitless.

Partly agree, but the point here is the energy and unfriendly chemistry along with a host of other engineering problems simply force the direction away from trying to create oil (here we presumably agree it's the low weight chained alkanes that are of interest). At the end of the day, oil is the result of vegetation capturing sunlight, so we'd simply skip that step.

Quote: chickenman

Partly agree, but the point here is the energy and unfriendly chemistry along with a host of other engineering problems simply force the direction away from trying to create oil (here we presumably agree it's the low weight chained alkanes that are of interest). At the end of the day, oil is the result of vegetation capturing sunlight, so we'd simply skip that step.

Theoretically all energy comes from sunlight, but oil also comes from the Hydrogen thrown off the sun and trapped deep down at the formation of the earth. Yes, we agree on low weight chained alkanes I suppose, I don't know the detailed chemistry except that yes, it is unfriendly and needs loads of pressure. My part is in land and title, but I need to know enough else to be more than a clerk.

It is the hydrogen that is key. The carbon is everywhere, Hydrogen does not care to go deep down. Even if we do not use my "planting" method we may learn how oil flows from really deep to just deep. If we figure out that then all the Hydrogen near the core can keep being tapped.

I tend to believe that hydrogen is key but not by trying to force it to where it doesn't want to go but rather pry it from where it is at: water. Here electrolysis, with the energy needed from hydro, solar etc springs the element out for limitless energy needs. I do get that the energy content much lower than familiar sources such as oil on a mass basis.

Quote: chickenman

I tend to believe that hydrogen is key but not by trying to force it to where it doesn't want to go but rather pry it from where it is at: water. Here electrolysis, with the energy needed from hydro, solar etc springs the element out for limitless energy needs. I do get that the energy content much lower than familiar sources such as oil on a mass basis.

Electrolysis is a possible idea, but how positive of an energy source does it make? Does the hydrogen locked in water have more energy than it takes to split and store it? Now you could use solar to split it off and then it becomes viable as a transport fuel as there is no good way to store solar in sight. My thought is if it was so simple we would see more experiments in that direction.