Fishing With Face

Quote: Face

And the depression ain't breaking, so that makes everything difficult.

'16 sucked. I guess I'm just burning '17 to ensure '18 don't.

They have good anti depression drugs if
you'll just take the damn things.

Quote: Evenbob

They have good anti depression drugs if
you'll just take the damn things.

I'm trying. God f#$%ing help me I'm trying.

I took one semi-recently. Just one, and it was on accident (damn unlabeled bottles). I knew what it was almost immediately; just as any other drug, there's certain feelings and a sort of progress they take. Got so goddamn sick. It was as if life was on X4 and I was on double slow. This while trying to sling mail with 500+ close approaches. Ended up with that tension... you know that tension in your neck just before it "breaks" and you break out in a shiver? Well, imagine that tension, but it never breaks. You never shiver, it never relieves. I was hanging out of the truck heaving for all I was worth. Then back to everything going 500mph while I trudged through molasses. Went to bed at 2100, fell asleep somewhere around 0300. Just stared at the ceiling fan.

Doc gave a different one. Was gonna make my back stop hurting, too. I expressed my concerns. He gave me the most pandering, horseshit speech. Told him I have adverse reactions, worried about being alone, being alone with kid, all I had to talk to was my dog. He told me don't even look up the side effects, just take them, and talk to my dog. 3 days to mentally prepare, now with hope of no back pain, and it was a carbon copy of the example above.

Sucks double because I was still having good days, finding my ways to break the fog. Pills f#$%ing shook everything back up and I'm in freefall again.

How come these spammers never offer pain meds?

You need to give your body time to adjust
to the new meds, you can't take just one
and quit because you didn't like it. Duh..

Quote: Face

How come these spammers never offer pain meds?

Are you still not taking the pain meds more than 3 weeks in a row? IDK, last time you were posting something tripped inside, and it felt like that funny old feeling of receptors being ripped loose from their roots ? It could have just been a bad dream?

Quote: Evenbob

You need to give your body time to adjust
to the new meds, you can't take just one
and quit because you didn't like it. Duh..

That s#$% is POISON. And god f#$%ing dammit, I don't NEED psyche meds. What I NEED is some goddamn pain relief so I can go out and produce. THAT is where the largest chunk of my depression comes from. I can't just sit on my ass all day, it makes me feel like dog dirt. I have a problem I can't fix cuz it hurts, that depresses me. I have some recreation I can't participate in cuz it hurts, that depresses me. Worried about finances because, hey, I might not be able to do this job or that task, that depresses me.

The "clinical depression", the SNAFU's in my brain that come and go, I know my way around those. And this here is pretty much my main coping mechanism. Feel like shit for no reason? Do something. Produce. That feel-good is enough to keep me on my feet until the darkness passes, and when it does pass, I have a pile of "good" that I've created waiting for me. Now I don't have that, and I'm adrift alone all over again.

Quote: petroglyph

Are you still not taking the pain meds more than 3 weeks in a row? IDK, last time you were posting something tripped inside, and it felt like that funny old feeling of receptors being ripped loose from their roots ? It could have just been a bad dream?

Nearing 3 years now -_-

I was on them regularly since '02. The first couple years were a mess as I learned how to use them. A lot of "abuse", sometimes from ignorance, thinking I could dose ALL the pain away, and sometimes just because I wanted the stamina boost they give to me. Reckon it must've been '05 or so when I figured out the "clean weeks" system and learned to accept the permanence of the injury. Since then, the max 1 a day (2 during tournaments) and the clean weeks have been my system and I've never strayed from it. So pretty much a decade of what I consider proper, fruitful use.

I lost med coverage when I left the casino, '14 or whenever. I had maybe 20-30 left and used them in emergencies only. Other than that, I've scored maybe another 30 from friends / family fresh out of surgery and displeased with the way vikes made them feel. I think I have one more, and I know it's not more than two.

Your talk about receptors, you talking about the way opiates have a tendency to increase pain after chronic use? If so, I don't think that's the case. I've been aware of that concern forever, and all through any clean week and even today, I find no difference in the pain I experience. I look for it, but it's just not happened to me. Ditto the inability to urinate, hallucinations, any of the really bad stuff. There's like an 8-12hr window of sexual dysfunction due to the sensitivity being numbed, and mild constipation after a few weeks of chronic use that is easily fixed by doubling my water intake. And those (plus possible liver strain from the acetaminophen) are the only "ill effects" vikes give me.

Can't bang for half a day and need to drink two bottles of water is a goddamn good trade to get your physical self back, IMO. But it seems everyone is so goddamn blinded by P&P's they won't look out and use their heads. If you give me a bottle of 120 - 5mg doses (like I got back in the day), and then you don't see my happy ass for 8 whole months, chances are I'm not inches away from the needle. When I voluntarily cease use just to keep them working, chances are I'm not a dipshit that's gonna find himself in trouble. But rather than see that I don't want 10's or even 7.5's, and 30 pills will last me at least 60 days (many go through 30 pills in half a week O.o), or test me and talk to me and try to figure something out, they just snap toss me some f#$%ing crazy pills that only serve to make me the exact loose cannon psychopath I'm trying to avoid becoming.

I've been addicted to s#$% before. If I was addicted to these, there'd be no clean weeks. There'd be no patience, there'd be no asking doctors. I'd be huddled in a group with the rest of the spooners and dope heads, just like I used to be. But I'm not, so being treated like I am or might become one is just so infuriating.

Quote: Face

Your talk about receptors, you talking about the way opiates have a tendency to increase pain after chronic use?

No, I was talking about withdrawals.

Quote:

I've been addicted to s#$% before. If I was addicted to these, there'd be no clean weeks. There'd be no patience, there'd be no asking doctors. I'd be huddled in a group with the rest of the spooners and dope heads, just like I used to be. But I'm not, so being treated like I am or might become one is just so infuriating.

There is a difference between addicts and those that are physically dependent. I went to some meetings and found out that I'm not and addict. That part of it is genetic or something? I don't crave or do anything illegal or the "dope opera". But I have been physically dependent after being in pain management for a long time.

I agree on the part where as soon as I can get out of pain, I am naturally a productive person. I like getting stuff done. When I have stopped pain management in the past, to prove I guess to myself that I could, I just lived in a lot of pain, but was near chair bound with bad discs.

It is a fine line between being and addict and being physically dependent, although the misery from detoxing seems to be near identical. When I take my breaks, I don't long for that feeling. I have talked to several dr's about it. The medicine works best if you only take enough to help take the edge off the pain. If someone takes enough, as you know, to not be in any pain, they are catatonic.

Lately I have been using MMJ edibles. During a treatment episode, there is a part of that duration that is productive, and the other parts as well. But I get active. MMJ is better medicine if it works suitably IMO. It's certainly happier medicine. No way should anybody drive after 10 or so mg's of edibles. YMMV

I have spoken with some pain patients who have had good results from using the herb "Kratom" for pain management.

Quote: petroglyph

It is a fine line between being and addict and being physically dependent, although the misery from detoxing seems to be near identical.

It sucks that you have to experience it to "get it", but I'm glad you do. One's a physiological process (dependency), the other psychological (addiction).

This furthers my anger with these people. My "withdrawal" is laughable. I have a day, maybe a day and a half, of feeling itchy. This is about as severe as winter time dry skin itch. It's scratching an area max three times and it's over. Hell, I'd take that side effect from an OTC and consider it a stellar product, as it's no ordeal at all. Physically, that's the only issue I can think of. Mentally, I'm a bit grouchy for a day, like I only got 6 hours sleep. Again, such a laughably minor effect. Within two days I'm my normal self, though not as chipper because now I hurt. But it's a lot different knowing you're gonna hurt a bit for a few weeks, then everything is better again, vs the thought of feeling like this for the next 50 f#$%ing years of getting worse and worse, ya know?

All the horror stories and not a one applies to me. I even had a new nurse, just yesterday, see my history and ask if I needed anything filled. This was the fourth opportunity I had to score on the sly, and I just reminded him that in what I consider my pain plan, I am due to have blood work first to monitor my liver. Hence, no pills. Three times I went to the dentist with an abscess, only once did I get a lil 5 pill script. Other than taking "extras" from fam, I ain't scored nothing. Haven't stolen any. Haven't black marketed any. Haven't moved to 10's (don't like em), haven't moved to oxy (make me sick), no methadone, no heroin, playing as arrow straight as I can. I don't chew em, don't snort em, don't binge out or use for recreation, I submit every single asked-for urine sample, and it just doesn't matter.

Weed is something, but it's not quite the something for me. I've tried a few edibles, some with straight weed chopped in it, some with hash oils, whatever the hell they're doing now. I guess I just don't "get" them. It has no effect on me, either function or recreation. It's just an oddly flavored candy or pastry. If I were to think of burning as a medical action, then I'd say it makes me tired and fuzzy headed, which is no good for productivity, while not doing all that much as far as relief. As I've said before, the relief it brings me is that it makes it easier for my head to accept laying about. I don't feel like a piece of s#$%, it becomes something I want to do. Until, of course, a few days roll by and a whole week of chores lie at my feet. Cue more depression.

Drinking works pretty good, but I don't enjoy drinking enough to make it work, and I sure as hell cannot afford the five figure first time felony tag we have here in NY.

I dunno. I'm gonna break either way. I just hope I'm in a good place when it happens. I'd like to do the same for this that I did with my teeth, I just need the right person to appear.

Quote: Face

My "withdrawal" is laughable.

Last time I did it, I took notes because I knew I would forget. I likened mine to liposuction without sedation.

Quote:

the thought of feeling like this for the next 50 f#$%ing years of getting worse and worse, ya know?

I do

Quote:

Drinking works pretty good,

Alcohol does work well. For me opiates don't help with all pain, but they do help very well with spinal pain. They don't help me at all with a headache, so no sense in taking them.

I finally determined that pain was the reason I drank so much so often for decades. It is an excellent painkiller. I like how if a finger hurts, than the pain relief from alcohol will help with the pain at the finger. Opiates only help me with my back or surgical pain, or radiation. But mostly just helpful with spinal pain.

You nailed it on how weed helps me with pain. I still hurt, but I don't care, and I can laugh some of it off. Opiates are a downer, they make me sullen. One complaint I have with the weed or alcohol is, I just don't want to be impaired. When I consume mmj edibles I first have to be willing to be stoned for 4 hours. I'm not willing to do that all the time. Alcohol of course, is dangerous to drive or use power tools. I am hi functioning while taking opiates. Why does anything that helps that much have to have such nasty side effects?

If you aren't being affected by the mmj edibles, your using to low a quality. Out this way thanks to Colorado they are standardizing the amount of thc or other cannabinoids in the edibles. The standard dose being agreed to is 10mg of thc. Some folks use much more. I can't do that, my aim is not to get blotto'd, my goal is to improve quality of life. I take 3 ibuprofens and 5-12 mg's of thc and it works pretty well, and I get busy. Maybe stupid as well, but if I'm that desperate for relief, I have made the conscious decision to trade sobriety for comfort. Chronic, debilitating pain sucks, no way around that.

Quote:

dunno. I'm gonna break either way. I just hope I'm in a good place when it happens.

I will give you a big amen to that. When my back finally cratered on me, I was at an extremely lucky place if it had to happen. I don't know your situation as far as the degeneration you mention and why your progressively getting worse. I want to say, the thing that has helped me the most of every procedure and modality I have taken, has been physical therapy. The pain is going to be there. Being able to function is critically important. I have to accept some of the things I can never do again, and I miss being physically active. Life's good, but it hurts a bit.

I told you if we are going to run the Parker 400 together, we need a third seat for the chiropractor. lol

Quote: petroglyph

Alcohol does work well. For me opiates don't help with all pain, but they do help very well with spinal pain. They don't help me at all with a headache, so no sense in taking them.

Same here. If I have a headache, migraine, sunburn, smash my hand with a hammer, take a puck to the shin, it doesn't even touch it. I wouldn't even think to take one for it. What I find it does / works good on is the "knife" pain. When you have that pinpoint, stabbing pain, vikes dull the point of it. It takes the spearhead off the shaft, and all you're left with is the wound. I can deal with that, it makes it manageable.

People react differently. Oxy made me feel like people describe opiates. That on-a-cloud, detached, drifting through the day feeling. I would agree that it's not an answer. I did some heroin in the way back once, mixed in with MDMA. I could've laid in that bed for 14 days. I simply melted. It was awful. But vikes, for whatever reason, pep me up. There's not even a thought of sleep, or even sit. I dunno if it's just me being a dog chained up too long and finally let loose or what, but when that kicks in I am ready to do anything. I know guys who react to weed like that. Couple puffs and they're landscaping for 4 hours straight. This is common knowledge, I just can't figure how no doctor will ever listen.

Quote: petro

I don't know your situation as far as the degeneration you mention and why your progressively getting worse.

I don't, either, as I've not been back since the original diagnosis of one burst and three bulging disks some... what, 11 years ago?

I too have found that "physical therapy" has been the best, long term, "real" answer. I hurt more when I'm "soft", after long periods of lessened physical activity. I've also lost 34lbs since I lost my prescription, so I hope that's making some difference. But honestly, the majority of my "degeneration" is mental in nature. My back is not spiraling out of control, rather it's just been so long without periodic relief and no sign any is coming that it's just burying me. Well, that and the fact that I pulled my bicep out of my shoulder and comp is a cluster f#$%.

It's a weird little storm of bulls#$% that only needs one link to get taken out to cease raging, but no one will hand me a bolt cutter.

Quote: petro

I told you if we are going to run the Parker 400 together, we need a third seat for the chiropractor. lol

You've never rode with me. I AM the chiropractor XD

I smoked opium a couple times in the
late 60's, holy crap. I can totally see why
it would be addictive. Everything was
wonderful, it makes the world look and
feel like a fantasy. No thanks. Totally
different than weed.