I Quit My Job

Also, the job reports are "estimates", the Birth death adjustments by the BLS are used to smooth out jobs reported.



The Birth death adjustment @ Motley Fool;http://caps.fool.com/Blogs/the-mysterious-birth-death/208858

For more accurate stats on employment, John Williams at Shadow Stats is the nuts; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shadowstats.com

Quote: AZDuffman

I was always taught that they use phone and I assume now other polling to get the rate, not UC stats.

looking into this briefly, you appear to be right. That means a lot of my previous posting was drivel. Sorry.

Quote: Face

I must say I am shocked at what I'm seeing now. I think my longest job search previous to this might have been 4-6 months. Typically, I'd send in apps and be on the job two weeks later, sort of a bing-bang-boom. And that was with no experience, terrible work history, and a pretty interesting drug habit. Not to mention little to no effort on resumes, cover letters, or call-backs.

My employment stability was very dependent upon the state of the economy, like plenty of us. It was just absolutely true that when things got bad, I got fired or was forced into a situation where to quit was for the best. Occasionally, I was laid off, a distinction the employers didn't like and avoided - it cost them to have to pay their portion of unemployment compensation.* Ugly reality there. Sometimes very ugly and sad.

Anyway, two things.


The difference between getting a job when companies really need somebody [they can get desperate judging by who I would sometimes see them hire] and a situation like now, when things suck plus they have reasons to feel they probably shouldn't be hiring a lot of people, is just enormous. Since you are 34, I think you may have not realized when you described your previous experience with it, that it was probably 'the good times'. When things are not only less than hopping, but actually in the toilet like now [or up to now if you are buying that] it was awful back then too, not just these days. 'Can't buy a job' - yep - I have experienced that in my day.

As will always be true, some things will have changed permanently. In my day, one resource was the newspaper want ads. It was *not* generally a good place to find a good job, but not impossible either. You had to wade through a lot of crap, including those ads that had to be placed by company rules but that were actually already filled. And other things, some worse. But it was there; forget it now [at least for my line of work such vanished]. Now I don't know where you look, you just seem to have to know where to apply. Then they tell you to apply by emailed resume or some internet process. You might think this is better, but IMO it is much worse than the old ways. The de-personalization of it is devastating. One outfit indicated that you were to use monster dot com. Wow, worst thing I ever did. Absolutely inundated with spam instantly, and there is no end to it, goes on to this day. Full of scams - it's humiliating to be unable to find the work you want and be presented with this fiction that there are all kinds of jobs out there. On the other end of the process, you have these awful HR people. Largely women, they are buffers put in place to impress you with their incompetence. In any case, you just seem to get lost in some black hole right off the bat. Like you, I felt it was ridiculous not to be considered for one company in particular; it was the one that had me use monster dot com. They were growing and surely had openings, but they just insisted this shitty process was the way they wanted it done. The current crop of HR people love this dreck. Well, I'm just saying the changes became one reason I just decided retirement was best. Dealing with it was just getting to be something I was not going to do. A young person today better figure it out.

I shouldn't have bored you with all that, sorry. My line of work was going through a process that was eliminating much of the work force too, so what should I or anybody expect? If you see this going on in your industry, beware, it gets ugly.

*my experience with unemployment compensation led me to imagine that process drove unemployment statistics, as there is quite an apparatus in place

Quote: Face

Not taken as rude. Even if you meant to be rude, I'd likely look past it to see what you're saying =)

And I do get what you're saying. But seriously, this is crazy. Not that I'm all that old or have a ton of experience in looking for jobs, but I must say I am shocked at what I'm seeing now. I think my longest job search previous to this might have been 4-6 months. Typically, I'd send in apps and be on the job two weeks later, sort of a bing-bang-boom. And that was with no experience, terrible work history, and a pretty interesting drug habit. Not to mention little to no effort on resumes, cover letters, or call-backs.

In evaluating myself, I fail to see where my problem lies. As I said, my resume / cover letter game isn't a generic piece that I shotgun to every open position. Each one is tailored to the specific needs of the job I'm seeking.

I really thought people would be banging down their doors to get a hold of me. I guess I got a little too cocky.

If you do not mind me asking, what are you looking for? Do you have a job/industry tagged or are you just kind of testing the waters?

Quote: odiousgambit

I shouldn't have bored you with all that, sorry.

Dude, not bored at all. Even if you're just bitching, I can use that. Sometimes talking helps, no matter what you're talking about.

I did think that things like Monster or Indeed or all the other online job searches were the cat's ass. I no longer had to rely on word of mouth or my sad little community Pennysaver, I had the hotline to everything within my radius and could bang out tons without spending gas money or even getting dressed. Looking back, not one single thing has come from all of the times I've used it, or the hundred resume / apps I've sent through it. I basically use it for ideas now, just to see what might be out there that I haven't thought of, then go look for similar on my own.

Quote: AZDuffman

If you do not mind me asking, what are you looking for? Do you have a job/industry tagged or are you just kind of testing the waters?

A. Job. lol Even if it's shit, I need something to patch the wound and stop the bleeding for now. Obviously working front line retail for nine and change isn't a career path, but it's something I've applied to every time one opens. Can't even get that. It's so weird.

There is a bit I just can't do. Most LEO type jobs have an age cutoff, which I'm at now. Border Patrol, Game Warden, Park Ranger, that type of stuff. And while I have tried to whore myself out for grunt work, I just can't be digging pools or tearing off roofs for 14hrs a day every day. I could Vicodin my way into having some good days, assuming I had health benefits, but even with it there would be days I'd be a complete anchor. Probably more often than not, unfortunately.

It's just weird, I can't put it any other way. Like I said, were I religious man, I would chalk this up to being some sort of test. My fishing buddy often does side stuff, what with being a CO and having so many days off. I hit him up to bring me in and he of course was all about it. He then immediately got into a prison scuffle and has been out on comp ever since. My next door neighbors needed a roof but were lamenting the cost. I told them I'd do it within their budget whenever they wanted, and I'm right next door. I'm serious in that all these odd jobs I've been doing have been at $3p/hr labor. I talk to them all the time. Came home last week to see a crew getting it done. Aunts and uncles always talking about how they tried to get my cousin to take this or that because they had friends with electric / HVAC jobs, I told them I'd take it in a second. No dice. Mayhem's new restaurant, I got tons of experience in loss prevention, auditing, retail, management; a ton of skills applicable to what he needed, and in a guy he can trust who he's known for 17 years. Didn't need me. Other teammates in electric and plumbing. No one wants to crawl under a house or dig a 6' deep hole in January. But Face is all about it. You need someone, I'm your guy. Yet, nothing.

I do have physical limits, at least where "slave labor" is concerned. I can't be tearing off roofs from 7a to 7p for $9 an hour and no bennys like I used to. And I do now have custody of my kid, so dinners and baths and homework and getting him to school - the structure kids need - throws a big wrench into a lot of stuff. It's probably my biggest hurdle, as most established employees snag the day and overnight positions for the same reason. But so far, none of my issues have become issues yet. I've applied to anything I am qualified and/or capable of doing, regardless of scheduling or finances, figuring I need to get in and can worry about details later. Yet again, nothing.

Just ranting now, but the fab shop was a real heartbreaker. They modify trucks, mostly for the state. Plow trucks, dump beds, that sort of thing. And it was pretty local, down home, the type of place I like working for, as opposed to big corp. All they were looking for was "shop labor", a $12 entry level gig. I was one of the few jobs I saw and said "I want that". I looked at it like it was being paid to go to school. I'd be wrenching, welding, painting, wiring, plumbing hydraulics... each one an individual skill that I could use in many ways in the future, both personal and professional. Now, I've held positions of evaluation. Whether in investigations or as management in the hiring process, I'm familiar with judging people knowing only a partial picture. If I saw me, with no tech school or job history of such, I'd be a little wary. But when I see that I've built my own car, wired it, painted it, swapped the motor, welded in my own cage, etc, and see that I kept it up all year and even won with it, I'd be thinking the guy has some knowledge that applies to the job at hand. When I'd check my history, I'd see someone who was successful, held high positions, and had glowing reviews, I'd see a guy that got stuff done. Big picture, I'd see a guy that would need some teaching and training, but that already has familiarity, is a proven good worker and intelligent fellow, who could be easily molded to fit their position, as opposed to maybe an experienced guy who's set in his ways about how he does things. In Wiz parlance, I'd look at myself as a good bet. But somehow, someway, I did not appeal to them.

I dunno, man. But it's not all bad. Maybe I'll post about that part next...

Quote: Face

A. Job. lol Even if it's shit, I need something to patch the wound and stop the bleeding for now. Obviously working front line retail for nine and change isn't a career path, but it's something I've applied to every time one opens. Can't even get that. It's so weird.

Front-line retail might as well have a sign up that people with skills need not apply. On that end, have you looked at the tire and oil shop at WMT? It pays a little better than the grunt work mopping the floors and is actually auto-related.

Question: how much unsolicited advice do you like from us? I like helping people in employment. It might be the one kind of "social work" I could actually do. But I know sometimes we just need to vent and want job advice about as much as swing advice on the golf course.

So, if I am piling on here say so and that will be it. OTOH, if an exchange of ideas is doing you good also say as I am looking now too and could be some mutually beneficial therapy or even give ideas.

Quote: Face

I dunno, man. But it's not all bad. Maybe I'll post about that part next...

This, along with our recent "In the News" postings about Disney, as well as petro's post earlier in the thread, are all involved.

Petro posted about koyaanisqatsi and he nailed it. My life is surely out of balance, and I am definitely in a transition phase. But just as I look back on my druggie years as a positive experience, so too do I find positives here.

Sometimes it takes losing everything to really highlight what's important. AZD mentioned in the "News" thread about saddling yourself with mortgage and car payments and so much bullshit that you essentially become enslaved. I agree with him, because I see it in myself. I had and still have a lot of worries, not having money. Hockey and fishing and racing all require cash, and all have added costs hidden within. Tires and gas for the racing, gas and equipment for the fishing, gas and ER bills for the hockey... everything that fills my spirit costs money, and all of it is in danger. And forget spirit for the moment, my life itself is in peril. The basic things like food, water, shelter, these are in the same peril as the fun stuff. I can afford, physically, to only eat 6 or 7 times a week right now. But I'm not a big guy, and that can't go on forever. And any little unpredictable thing - a refinery fire in Louisiana, a hurricane in Alabama - that makes gas prices, and therefore, every good and service, spike in price, and I'm really in the shit.

Times like this strip away all the bullshit that society gets you wrapped up in. The having to be cool, or do interesting things, or Keeping up with the Joneses. I'll miss BVI this year, I won't pretend I don't. But somehow being able to scratch $35 together so I can take my kid out for burgers and then hit the lake, wasn't that every bit as good, maybe better? In many ways, it was. In all the ways that matter, yes, it definitely was.

And how much did I like all that stuff, the things I was involved in? What have I been doing just because it was something to do, vs doing it because my soul needed it? Y'all saw me stress and cry for over a year in my Racing thread. For a long time, it was my biggest priority, what consumed my life the most. I still miss it, I still aim to be back, but the struggle and the effort, the pride and the joy, somehow got smacked perfectly into perspective now. It's just a "thing", now. It's something I took pride in then, something that's teaching me patience now. I no longer question if it's worth it, or stress that it's "not good enough". It's become a complete positive on all sides, and when I make it back, the whole thing is going to change. And hockey. My god. Hockey is a lot of things, but the one thing it does that makes it special sometimes gets lost. Maybe not lost, but at least diluted. When I stepped onto the ice for the first time last week, it was as if I was 17 again. All of the excitement, the energy, all came back magnified and highlighted. It's not something I do just to do, or try to cram in amidst the hundred other things I got going on. It's back to being special, back to being that Thing I Need, it's something I have to work very hard at just to be able to participate. The spirituality of it all is back 100%.

And then there's the kid. As much as it pains me not being able to take him here or buy him that, the Really Important Stuff probably could not have happened had I been a working stiff. I went through a long and arduous court process. There were no distractions. I wasn't worried about work, or thinking about an investigation while I'm talking to an attorney. Every second was completely focused on the task at hand, because the task at hand was all I had. Somewhere along the way, his mother and I has a sort of "falling in". Our relationship is the best it's been, even better than it was in most of the time we were together. It's to the point I not only don't cringe when she calls, but sometimes even look forward to talking to her, which can only be good for my kid's future. And let's face it, stereotypically, dad's are judged as "lesser" when it comes to the day-to-day child rearing, and I'm no different. We had a really good time when I taught him all about blood. How it's made, all its parts and functions, what it does, etc. But when it comes to tying shoes, coloring in the lines, I ain't worth a lick. Being not only the primary caregiver but the sole caregiver, with his mom gone and no girl in the house, is intimidating to the extreme. But because of the mess I'm in, I've had all day to do it. Today, for example, was a mellow morning. Cartoons and cereal and shower and dress, conversation about school and cleaning up after yourself, instituting a reward program for good behavior, and all the other "good" stuff about child rearing. I wasn't rushing, yelling at him to hurry up, carting him off in silence because I had a whole day at the office on my mind. In this period of transition, he has my all because he is all I have. Part of that is crushingly sad, but the vast majority of it really is a blessing. Again, not that I've ever been one to chalk things up to fate, but so much is coming from this struggle that it's almost as if it was meant to happen.

So yeah. I am angry, and getting more bitter and jaded by the day. Perhaps my postings as of late have been giving that away. But I don't look at it as a bad thing. I was too soft anyways, and sometimes it takes an asshole to get things done. And every day that goes by, I get hungrier and do more things and find more treasures in the detritus that was my former life. When your house gets to a certain level, sometimes it's easier to just burn it down and start over. I like to think that's what I did. All I gotta do now is rebuild it, and nobody builds a shitty house. Here's hoping mine is exemplary.

Quote: AZDuffman

Question: how much unsolicited advice do you like from us? I like helping people in employment. It might be the one kind of "social work" I could actually do. But I know sometimes we just need to vent and want job advice about as much as swing advice on the golf course.

So, if I am piling on here say so and that will be it. OTOH, if an exchange of ideas is doing you good also say as I am looking now too and could be some mutually beneficial therapy or even give ideas.

There was a song that came out about the time I graduated. Even today, it never fails to make me well up in tears...



It reminds me of my grandpa. As I've said before, I was largely raised by him. And like all old men, he's always quick with the advice. And like all younger folks, most look at him like "lol".

His advice, like this song, stays with me. When I don't want it, or even when I don't understand it, I find there's eventually a point in my life when I need it, where it makes sense. Things that didn't resonate or that I looked at as "crazy" suddenly make all of the sense in the world.

I remember addressing Ahigh during one of his various meltdowns. He was so focused on the negative responses, he missed entirely the value that could be found within them. They just weren't what he wanted, so he dismissed the whole thing. Damn me if I ever do that. That's why I like arguing with you about the gays, or FrG about God, or rxwine about guns. Yes-men who tell you everything you want to hear teach you nothing. Growth comes from conflict. If you want new ideas, sometimes you have to subject yourself to having them jammed into your head.

So post away. Worst case I don't reply. But even then, I'll be thinking about it, carrying it with me until its usefulness is revealed.

I'll say it again, it's not you, it's the depressed area
you live in. If you lived in W MI you would have a
job by next week.

When my dad was in his mid 40s, he got an offer with a better salary and position in another state in the same company he worked in..

So, the house was sold and we moved to Texas and bought a new home in a brand new neighborhood. Everything was great for a couple years, then he had a new hire provided by someone on the board of directors over his office. I believe it was this person's niece. Unfortunately this person was a complete waste.

I guess he struggled for awhile trying to make the best of the situation, but eventually he fired her. Her uncle on the board got my dad fired.

In a couple months we were out of the house living in a two bedroom apartment. The only job my dad had found in those months was selling life insurance door to door. From what my mother said, it was pretty tough. People slamming the door on him. For the sales he made, it was only after a lot of contacts.

I was really too young to even notice we were on hard times. My sister was about 5 years older. My older brother had just gone into the Marines.

Anyway, after a year of this, he managed to get a job in his old company in another state. He bought a new house, but it was pretty shoddy. Eventually, he worked his way back up the ladder before retiring.