Refugees in Germany -- Crisis or Much Needed Labor?

Quote: Evenbob

I got to know some young Muslim guys
from Bosnia and they were fine. But they
were non practicing Muslims, they never
went to services knew little about the
religion.

It is not individuals, it is the culture. It is why there was Indian removal in the USA in the 1800s. The cultural difference was too much to expect side-by-side living. However, sadly, western civilization is near-terminal population decline and will not be able to fend off a cultural invasion for much more than another generation. Still I think it is crazy to speed up the process.

Quote: AZDuffman

Still I think it is crazy to speed up the process.

I remember reading years ago that
Muslims teach the grade school
kids in Palestine that all the tall,
beautiful air conditioned buildings
in Tel Aviv will one day be full
of nothing but Muslims. They will
run Israel and not the Jews. The
only problem is, they have no
qualifications to run anything. The
buildings would all be slums in 2
years.

What's funny is, nobody wanted the
land where Israel is before the Jews
got it. There was nothing there except
a wasteland.

Quote: Wizard

She mentioned that Germany has a very low fertility rate of about 1.5, which left alone would cause a dangerous decrease in the population, not to a very high ratio of aged people to younger adults in the work force.

She is massively understating the situation.

The US census department's international database has information back as far as 1991. For that year
Germany had 830,236 births, and 911,021 deaths and 602,281 immigrants. So as far back as a quarter century ago Germany had a negative natural growth rate. Who knows how low it would have been without migration from Turkey in the 1970's and 1980's.

Interestingly enough the database says a mere 100,259 immigrants for 2015 (much less than in 1991). But the natural growth is even lower with 684,837 birth offsetting 923,357 deaths.

A theoretical Germany without immigration would either have to start having babies or be nearly dead in half a century. Interestingly enough, it is believed that USA would maintain its population for 50 years without immigration.

On the other hand, Germany has a Density (Persons Per Sq. Km.=231.9 or 600 ppl sq mile)
Region ppl/sq km
1 Mid-Atlantic 160.8
2 New England 90.0
3 South Atlantic 90.0
4 East North Central 74.2
5 East South Central 40.5
6 West South Central 34.4
7 Pacific 22.2
8 West North Central 15.9
9 Mountain 10.3

So only Mid-Atlantic region even comes close to Germany.

Quote: Evenbob

I remember reading years ago that
Muslims teach the grade school
kids in Palestine that all the tall,
beautiful air conditioned buildings
in Tel Aviv will one day be full
of nothing but Muslims. They will
run Israel and not the Jews. The
only problem is, they have no
qualifications to run anything. The
buildings would all be slums in 2
years.

What's funny is, nobody wanted the
land where Israel is before the Jews
got it. There was nothing there except
a wasteland.

Muslims destroyed the productive greenhouses Israel left for them in Gaza. I feel no pity for them. Then never miss a chance to miss a chance to live better.

Quote: AZDuffman

It is not individuals, it is the culture. It is why there was Indian removal in the USA in the 1800s. The cultural difference was too much to expect side-by-side living.

Where, though, do you draw the line?

I think I agree with your premise. It's the same in another thread where we talked about like attracting like. But I happen to feel that diversity does serve a purpose and should in no way be stamped out. Certainly some go too far, and we call them supremacists. Others go too far the other way and we call them bleeding hearts. Where is that middle?

As an aside - I'm not into this whole issue. Just about every word I've heard of it has come by way of AZD and EB's fingers. But I have seen pictures. I've seen Haitian refugees, I've seen Japanese, Vietnamese, many different exoduses (exodi?) from many different areas and cultures. 100% of the time, they've looked either completely emotionally crushed or so beyond thankful you can almost feel the pull at your heart from the picture.

How come all the men from this fleeing always look completely pissed off and demanding? Media spin? Cultural difference? Something feels off.

Quote: Face

How come all the men from this fleeing always look completely pissed off and demanding? Media spin? Cultural difference? Something feels off.

I am going to go with cultural differences.

The problem is that you have grown up western and American. Western culture and Americans in particular want to treat people "right" and fair, do the right thing. We think that nobody means us harm and if we can just show them how good our culture is then by golly they will adopt it and all will be wonderful!

Take it all back to the Brits and French, which is where western culture as we know it formed. Across Europe it moved and was adopted 1600s-1900. Various parts of Asia took it in with their own local sort of style. Japan is the best example. When Perry landed there they saw where things were going and changed. After WWII again the writing was on the wall, so they changed more.

But muslims want no part of this at all. They do not like what they see, are not buying what we are selling. The refugees you are seeing are sort of like a person in the 1600s who was forced to settle in the New World. Debt Prisoners in GA did not want to be there, did they? Puritans wanted to leave but did they assimilate with local Indians?

I get that so many people want to be noble and nice, but they are closing their eyes to what is happening. We are seeing a once-in-hundreds-of-years cultural migration. Said migrations have never once worked out for the people already there. Those of us reading this will survive and possibly thrive as we may own property or have some skills to exploit the situation. But a generation later watch out.

It is important to be distinctive and talk about extremist Muslims vs mainstream Muslims. Learn the Koran and don't be ignorant. 93% of Muslims live in peace alongside Christians and other religions, just like 99%+ of Christians live peacefully among other religions.

And we know from the immigrant waves in the past that like people congregate together. Yes, they will try to change the laws to the laws they are used it to reflect their muslim beliefs. And if they pull it off, that's democracy in action as a result of the foreign policy of allowing the refugees in.

Quote: boymimbo

And if they pull it off, that's democracy in action as a result of the foreign policy of allowing the refugees in.

That is such a "wow" comment.

I grew up thinking democracy was the bee's knees. Talk about fair. Everyone has a voice. Then I realize it wasn't all fun and games because there's a lot of people and not everyone was like me. So we fight about gays or weed or guns,... but at least, on the whole, it's still America.

I never contemplated the thought of what if foreigners (not immigrants, but foreigners) ever had the numbers to exert some control. Dunno about where you live, but if two buses of them folks show up at my door, they just became my town's majority.

No, this isn't an end-of-days xenophobic parade on my part. But it is an interesting thought.

Quote: AZDuffman

We are seeing a once-in-hundreds-of-years cultural migration. Said migrations have never once worked out for the people already there.

We're seeing one culture invade another
with the goal of taking it over, like the
Europeans did here 300 years ago. And
because EU is so stupid socially, they will
lay back and let it happen. Hitler had an
easy time of doing the same thing, until
we got into it. No different now, still
full of the same complacent suckers.

The way I look at it, the US was a native-American country before the Brits came over. They annexed parts of the nation and colonized.
Africa is much the same... lots of colonialization.
This is the same.