The Holy Trinity

Quote: FrGamble

Yeah the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are one God. Remember the 3 leaves of the one shamrock. The leaves wouldn't disagree would they? There are all one God in three persons.

I still don't get it. I can get that god and Jesus could have a conversation about the price of tea in China and be in complete agreement about it. However, if they are separate entities, it still seems like three gods, albeit closely in agreement, to me.

Quote: Wizard

I still don't get it.

And you never will because there's
nothing to 'get'. That's the whole
point of it!!! Again, this concept
was invented because it absolutely
cannot be explained or understood.
So when the priests told their flock
not to worry, the Church understood
it, this put another degree of
authority between the enlightened,
the Church, and the ignorant, the
flock.

Evenbob, you know that is not right. Every Christian believes in the Trinity and you do not need a priest to describe to you that there is one God in three persons. You keep shouting like a crazy person that it is meant to be impossible to understand and it was a power grab from priests to put down the laity. None of its true. If you just took a deep breath and calmed down you would see that.

Quote: Wizard

I still don't get it. I can get that god and Jesus could have a conversation about the price of tea in China and be in complete agreement about it. However, if they are separate entities, it still seems like three gods, albeit closely in agreement, to me.

Something that might help is to think of the difference between an idea and the word that expresses that idea. They are distinct separate realities but still one.

Quote: Evenbob

And you never will because there's
nothing to 'get'. That's the whole
point of it!!! Again, this concept
was invented because it absolutely
cannot be explained or understood.
So when the priests told their flock
not to worry, the Church understood
it, this put another degree of
authority between the enlightened,
the Church, and the ignorant, the
flock.

In all fairness, Protestants have to wrestle with this too, and they don't have a centralized authority like the Catholic church does. The older denominations like Lutherans tend to mention the trinity a lot more than the newer non-denominational churches. Ultimately, most Protestants will have the same kind of explanation that FrG does. If faced with the tough questions they will throw up their hands and say, "Some things you have to accept as a mystery."

As mentioned before, some Protestant branches totally reject the trinity and say all three are exactly one and the same, no separate parts.

Quote: Wizard

In all fairness, Protestants have to wrestle with this too,

Of course, they took trinity with them
when they split from the Church. In
many ways they are more nuts about
it than the Catholics. My wife can't
explain it and she thinks that's wonderful,
that god is soooo mysterious. Nobody
in her family understands it, but they
all think it's wonderful. It goes with
the mindset you must have to be a
god believer. Reason has to go out the
window.

Quote: FrGamble

Something that might help is to think of the difference between an idea and the word that expresses that idea. They are distinct separate realities but still one.

Wow, that's clear as mud. It explains
absolutely nothing.

You know Evenbob I don't think it is that you can't understand the Trinity. It is more that you choose not to. It is also more of a case that you don't believe in the Trinity than you don't understand it.

Quote: FrGamble

I don't think it is that you can't understand the Trinity.

NOBODY understands it! If they
did they could EXPLAIN it and
they can't! You're doing what
the priests have always done,
pretending to understand it
and feeling oh so sorry for those
that don't.

A.W. Tozer, in his book The Knowledge of the Holy , writes that the Trinity is an “" incomprehensible mystery" ” and that attempts to understand it “" must remain forever futile." ”

I don't believe you can't understand it. How about if you ask me a question about what you don't understand?

I'm also wondering if you are conflating understanding with complete knowledge of? You don't have complete knowledge of how the sun works, but I reckon you have an understanding of it.