The Coronavirus thread

Quote: AZDuffman

Trump to 'suspend immigration into the United States' by executive order amid coronavirus

Libs come out against social distancing!

Just another lame attempt by Donny to deflect his massive failings onto brown people.

It'll work for those ~35% of hopeless cases who love his every move. Everyone else can see right through it.

If anything, other countries should be preventing Americans from coming to them. We've got it way worse here because Donny was too busy talking about "hoaxes" and holding rallies in January, February, and March than actually being POTUS and responding to the oncoming crisis.

Quote: petroglyph

The US will bail out the peso again, imo.

Possibly. Now with a drop of over 20% that might translate into a million attempted illegal immigrant crossings.

The President has to deal with every statement he makes being recorded.
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Jan. 22: “We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China. We have it under control. It’s going to be just fine.” — Trump in a CNBC interview.

Jan. 30: “We think we have it very well under control. We have very little problem in this country at this moment — five — and those people are all recuperating successfully. But we’re working very closely with China and other countries, and we think it’s going to have a very good ending for us … that I can assure you.” — Trump in a speech in Michigan.

Feb. 10: “Now, the virus that we’re talking about having to do — you know, a lot of people think that goes away in April with the heat — as the heat comes in. Typically, that will go away in April. We’re in great shape though. We have 12 cases — 11 cases, and many of them are in good shape now.” — Trump at the White House. (See our item “Will the New Coronavirus ‘Go Away’ in April?“)

Feb. 14: “There’s a theory that, in April, when it gets warm — historically, that has been able to kill the virus. So we don’t know yet; we’re not sure yet. But that’s around the corner.” — Trump in speaking to National Border Patrol Council members.

Feb. 23: “We have it very much under control in this country.” — Trump in speaking to reporters.

Feb. 24: “The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!” — Trump in a tweet.

Feb. 26: “So we’re at the low level. As they get better, we take them off the list, so that we’re going to be pretty soon at only five people. And we could be at just one or two people over the next short period of time. So we’ve had very good luck.” — Trump at a White House briefing.

Feb. 26: “And again, when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done.” — Trump at a press conference.

Feb. 26: “I think every aspect of our society should be prepared. I don’t think it’s going to come to that, especially with the fact that we’re going down, not up. We’re going very substantially down, not up.” — Trump at a press conference, when asked if “U.S. schools should be preparing for a coronavirus spreading.”

Feb. 27: “It’s going to disappear. One day — it’s like a miracle — it will disappear.” — Trump at a White House meeting with African American leaders.

Feb. 29: “And I’ve gotten to know these professionals. They’re incredible. And everything is under control. I mean, they’re very, very cool. They’ve done it, and they’ve done it well. Everything is really under control.” — Trump in a speech at the CPAC conference outside Washington, D.C.

March 4: “[W]e have a very small number of people in this country [infected]. We have a big country. The biggest impact we had was when we took the 40-plus people [from a cruise ship]. … We brought them back. We immediately quarantined them. But you add that to the numbers. But if you don’t add that to the numbers, we’re talking about very small numbers in the United States.” — Trump at a White House meeting with airline CEOs.

March 4: “Well, I think the 3.4% is really a false number.” — Trump in an interview on Fox News, referring to the percentage of diagnosed COVID-19 patients worldwide who had died, as reported by the World Health Organization. (See our item “Trump and the Coronavirus Death Rate.”)

March 7: “No, I’m not concerned at all. No, we’ve done a great job with it.” — Trump, when asked by reporters if he was concerned about the arrival of the coronavirus in the Washington, D.C., area.

March 9: “So last year 37,000 Americans died from the common Flu. It averages between 27,000 and 70,000 per year. Nothing is shut down, life & the economy go on. At this moment there are 546 confirmed cases of CoronaVirus, with 22 deaths. Think about that!” — Trump in a tweet.

March 10: “And we’re prepared, and we’re doing a great job with it. And it will go away. Just stay calm. It will go away.” — Trump after meeting with Republican senators.

A day later, on March 11, the WHO declared the global outbreak a pandemic.

Quote: Shrek

Well I apologize that you felt that way after reading my post, but I don't understand why you would be insulted that I believe the country is being unnecessarily scared into a lockdown and thinking they're gonna die if they get this virus.

Just so you know, I had an elderly 81 year old relative die after getting the flu 8 years ago, but I didn't go around scaring people into staying home for 2 months and giving up their jobs & small businesses. I also had a 62 year old relative die of prostate cancer 5 years before that, but again I didn't go around scaring people into into a lockdown and believing that they're gonna of cancer even though cancer has killed a hell of a lot more people than this virus. So yeah, I would have opposed a phony "scare" in those cases too.

I won't ask how much you make, but I assume you're pretty well off. Just so you know, there are people out there that aren't so well off and live paycheck to paycheck. They're hurting right now because they have no income and I think they're being unnecessarily scared by idiot politicians whose families are eating just fine.

There are also people out there who own small businesses that they spent their entire lives building, and they may lose those businesses again because of politicians that basically just established a police state in places like California and Michigan. So yeah, I think the whole thing is overblown, and I have dead family members in my past too!!

Thoughtful response. You are aware that those low income workers are all making MORE unemployed when you include the regular State unemployment and bonus federal unemployment money. MUCH MORE. Which is part of the absolute idiocy of the plan. The long term devastation to America by this give away of money we don't have will hurt us for decades to come. No one who had a low income job is not BETTER off during this federal giveaway, unless they were working off the books, meaning illegally.

I agree with you about the small business owners.

But just like you think I am insulated from the financial parts of the crisis because I made a good living, you are insulated from the actual real life and death facts of this. NYC ALONE has 500+ deaths a day for quite a while. Try and get your head around that one. Just like most people really can't understand what a trillion dollars is, 500-1000 dead people a day in a single locale from a single disease which was unheard of last year is difficult to comprehend.

I'll try and find common ground with you. As is usual, especially when power hungry (Cuomo) men are in charge, there are overreaches. My go to example is the closing of golf courses in NYS because they weren't 'essential'. I was interviewed for our local TV station lauding the decision to allow them to be open, pointing out the costly social distancing measures that were put in place. The courses would only be able to handle half their usual business, but half is better than zero. The closing occurred a day or two after my interview. So for two weeks (Cuomo just changed his mind again!) the courses were closed. FOR NO GOOD REASON.

So my answer is this...... If the dry cleaners can be open safely, why can't the wedding planning shop? When we were planning our wedding, we would make an appointment, go into the shop, talk with the proprietor, look through albums or at her computer , and make a purchase. The most other people in the store was ONE. She can EASILY conduct business using social distancing guidelines.

Let her open TODAY. No stupid "phases" needed.

My two sons..... One works in a six person office.... big enough to be 'rated' 40 person occupancy. Plenty of room between each other. Almost no clients/visitors ever come there. Let them open TODAY.
Second son works essentially all by himself in a big lab at University of Florida. (Deemed non-essential). There may be others in the same lab but he can easily work using social distancing rules. Let him work there TODAY.

Concert planned with mosh pit..... keep it closed for now.
Marathon with 10000 people jammed together at the starting line..... nope.....

Tennis match with no fans? Why the frick not?

Quote: Pacomartin

The President has to deal with every statement he makes being recorded.

He was optimistic, based upon what was known at the time. He had faith in the professionals who were telling him and the American public in February, the virus was not a big deal, and the flu was worse.

As late as March 9, Fauci said “If you are a healthy young person, there is no reason if you want to go on a cruise ship, go on a cruise ship.”

Then go home and spread the disease all over the place.

Trump prevented panic, preserved the economy and saved jobs while there were still less than 600 cases and only 22 deaths by March 9th.

This is a timeline of the actions he has taken since January, to combat the spread of the virus.

Quote: SOOPOO

But just like you think I am insulated from the financial parts of the crisis because I made a good living, you are insulated from the actual real life and death facts of this. NYC ALONE has 500+ deaths a day for quite a while. Try and get your head around that one. Just like most people really can't understand what a trillion dollars is, 500-1000 dead people a day in a single locale from a single disease which was unheard of last year is difficult to comprehend.

What is the normal death per day in NYC? Because when I hear a raw number I always ask "compared to what?"

Quote: AZDuffman

What is the normal death per day in NYC? Because when I hear a raw number I always ask "compared to what?"

Of course. Much less than that from all sources. At the peak of 1,000 a day, thats 350,000 a year or so. I don't know the number, but it is a fraction of that. We in Buffalo now have more than 100 patients on ventilators in ICUs due to COVID. Probably more than would be from all other causes.
Of course anecdotal, but I've asked my friends at NYC hospitals (during the peak) how many patients they were intubating daily due to Covid. They would say 12, 14, etc.... I asked them how many would they intubate daily for non-COVID reasons. 1-2 on average, if there happened to be a bad car accident maybe 3 or 4.

I know NYC is huge, overpopulated.... But try and close your eyes and see 1000 body bags lined up daily from this ONE cause.

I've said it from day one. At some point we will need open things up despite the additional deaths it will cause. I think in the post you copied part of, I gave some specific examples of businesses that should be open today with social distancing rules in effect.

No one can know for sure how many lives have been saved by crippling the economy.

How about a poll....


I am willing to accept _____ more deaths to fully open the economy.

0
10
100
1000
10000
100000
1000000

My guess is without the original lockdown, the number would have been in the 100,000 range. I think the fatality rate will be lower per case than quoted, and individuals would still have the right to self quarantine. Plus non-crippling changes would help.... hand sanitizers everywhere, masks worn in crowded public areas, etc....

My answer would have been 10,000 additional deaths. Like an add on to a bad flu season.

Quote: AZDuffman

What is the normal death per day in NYC? Because when I hear a raw number I always ask "compared to what?"

There is a death every 9.1 minutes, on average, in NYC (this is on a site giving various statistics on NYC; it is quoted and sourced somewhere in this thread).

That comes out to 158 deaths per day...so the death rate has been a lot higher than average at the peak of this infection.

Montana stepping up their Big Brother game


https://montanadailygazette.com/2020/04/14/montana-county-demands-people-wear-government-issued-arm-bands-to-do-business/

Quote: aceofspades

Montana stepping up their Big Brother game


https://montanadailygazette.com/2020/04/14/montana-county-demands-people-wear-government-issued-arm-bands-to-do-business/

They could just put up "You're not welcome here stranger." signs.

Quote: SOOPOO

Of course. Much less than that from all sources. At the peak of 1,000 a day, thats 350,000 a year or so. I don't know the number, but it is a fraction of that. We in Buffalo now have more than 100 patients on ventilators in ICUs due to COVID. Probably more than would be from all other causes.
Of course anecdotal, but I've asked my friends at NYC hospitals (during the peak) how many patients they were intubating daily due to Covid. They would say 12, 14, etc.... I asked them how many would they intubate daily for non-COVID reasons. 1-2 on average, if there happened to be a bad car accident maybe 3 or 4.

I know NYC is huge, overpopulated.... But try and close your eyes and see 1000 body bags lined up daily from this ONE cause.

I've said it from day one. At some point we will need open things up despite the additional deaths it will cause. I think in the post you copied part of, I gave some specific examples of businesses that should be open today with social distancing rules in effect.

No one can know for sure how many lives have been saved by crippling the economy.

How about a poll....


I am willing to accept _____ more deaths to fully open the economy.

0
10
100
1000
10000
100000
1000000

My guess is without the original lockdown, the number would have been in the 100,000 range. I think the fatality rate will be lower per case than quoted, and individuals would still have the right to self quarantine. Plus non-crippling changes would help.... hand sanitizers everywhere, masks worn in crowded public areas, etc....

My answer would have been 10,000 additional deaths. Like an add on to a bad flu season.

I will accept 1,000,000. Considering we are losing 1 trillion per month, that is one million per china virus death. But it is not all that bad as so many of the deaths so far are people who were in very bad shape having at most a year left to live. Then add in the lives lost because of suicides, OD's and other ways because of the lockdown and potential depression following.

Just heard hospitalizations in NYC are 87 per 100,000. That is not high at all, most areas are below 10 per.