Original Sin?

Quote: FrGamble

Man, Ace talk about confusing the issue. Let's just dwell on this point for a second. If I understand you correctly you are saying that the only thing you will accept for determining the existence or non-existence of something is tangible proof, something you can touch, see, or observe. Do I have that right? I hope I don't because I believe that is a very silly thing to hold. If you do in fact believe that then please provide me with the tangible proof you have to support the idea that the only proof we can accept is tangible?

If I will accept faith then my faith in fairy unicorns and talking rainbows should be proof enough for you that they indeed exist as well...

Faith needs to be grounded in something more than your wishes and dreams. Faith needs reasonable evidence to support it. You wouldn't believe in something for no good reason would you? Of course not.

So I will not accept that you believe in fairy unicorns and talking rainbows just on faith. Nor will I accept that the only evidence to believe in something is tangible proof, unless of course you can show me some type of tangible proof that this idea is true.

Quote: FrGamble

Faith needs to be grounded in something more than your wishes and dreams. Faith needs reasonable evidence to support it. You wouldn't believe in something for no good reason would you? Of course not.

So I will not accept that you believe in fairy unicorns and talking rainbows just on faith. Nor will I accept that the only evidence to believe in something is tangible proof, unless of course you can show me some type of tangible proof that this idea is true.

FrG you are speaking out of both sides of your mouth….my irrational beliefs based on faith are wrong….but yours are not...

Precisely because belief in Jesus Christ is not irrational!

What is irrational is believing that tangible proof is the only type of evidence that can lead to conclusions about what to believe or whether something exists or not.

Also please don't respond that my faith in Christianity, and the millions of others who also believe, is akin to belief in something like talking rainbows - I'm sick enough and that might just push me over the edge.

Quote: FrGamble

Precisely because belief in Jesus Christ is not irrational!

What is irrational is believing that tangible proof is the only type of evidence that can lead to conclusions about what to believe or whether something exists or not.

Also please don't respond that my faith in Christianity, and the millions of others who also believe, is akin to belief in something like talking rainbows - I'm sick enough and that might just push me over the edge.

I am sure mass delusion (pun intended) will not make you any sicker (get well soon padre)

hPIUHV PUIHRPUH@V{ fjksn[ofNdOH{wjf] oz 'zkmn'skj Jvjm'ZLM'pM
sorry just vomited on keyboard

Quote: FrGamble

Precisely because belief in Jesus Christ is not irrational!
.

To you it's not, to me it's beyond the boundries
of rational thought. I want an invisible friend
who saved me from something I don't believe in
(original sin) who I now depend on for everything
in my life? For me, not for you, obviously, but
for me, being who I am, for who I've become up
to this point, believing in Jesus would be the same
as putting me in a straight jacket in a mental ward.

It goes against everything I take for granted. It offers
me something I don't need and don't want. You need
Jesus to save you from original sin. I don't need him
because original sin is obvious poppycock, so Jesus
means nothing to me. A nice guy who said some nice
things, one of many who did in the past. You've arranged
your life so you really need Jesus. I've arranged mine
so I don't. What's the difference.

You keep railing against original sin, why? I'm going to take a guess here and say that you are not perfect. If you indeed are not perfect why not? You are the master of your own destiny, you have created yourself, who you are and who you've become to this point. You didn't need no help from nobody, much less some invisible spiritual friend. Then why aren't you perfect? Why in your heart of hearts do you want more, to be better, and to be freed from certain addictions and sins in your life or in the past? You've arranged your life to pretend your perfect, that you don't need Jesus, I've arranged mine because I know I'm not perfect and I need Him.

Quote: FrGamble

You keep railing against original sin, why? .

Because the concept is preposterous. The whole
universe was created as a moral experiment?
C'mon, nothing in nature supports this. I said
earlier that the priests had the hardest time
getting the natives to swallow this, they found
it silly and couldn't take it seriously. It got so bad
the priests eventually opened schools and got
to the kids early, a kid will believe anything.

And of course the whole Xtion religion is built
on original sin. Jesus can't save you from something
you don't believe is true, he's useless. Dr Woomba's
magic pills won't work if you don't swallow the
fact you have an incurable unheard of disease first.

Okay since you and I seem to keep missing each other with me asking the same questions and you saying the same old stuff, lets just chalk this failure to communicate up to original sin.

p.s. I hope you realize that you are wrong about the acceptance of the Gospel message in the new world and the reasoning behind forming schools.