"Cult of Mary"

Quote: Evenbob

The universe doesn't have an ego, but you do.
Why would it care more about a person
than it does about an insect, they're all the
same in the scheme of things.

Then I guess the question is why should we care about the universe if it doesn't care about us?

Quote:

The world really becomes a place of wonder
when you stop looking at it as the playground god gave
you and you alone, and look at it from the perspective
that you're not any more important than anything
else.

There is an attractive humility to your thought. Isn't there a way we could recognize how unique and special we are as human beings and yet still see that we are part of a much larger ecosystem and universe? You seem to think that acknowledging we are special in some way degrades the rest of the universe. The wonder we feel about the universe does not come because we see it as a cold hard uncaring place where there are no distinctions and all is equally special aka nothing is special. We wonder at the universe because we can wonder! This ability to wonder and discuss these things on an internet forum is a gift that is uniquely ours and should fill us with respect and awe for our dogs and the trees, but not because they are the same as us, but because we are so gifted. Your playing small doesn't benefit anything, rejoice and celebrate your humanity not to the detriment of the world, but for its benefit.

Quote: FrGamble

Then I guess the question is why should we care about the universe if it doesn't care about us?

We are the universe, the universe is us.
It's me and it's you and it's the cockroach.
He knows this. So do we, but we have
egos that get in the way.

Quote:

Your playing small doesn't benefit anything

Being equal is playing small? No, lording it
over everything thinking you're god's gift
is playing small.

Quote: Evenbob

Being equal is playing small? No, lording it
over everything thinking you're god's gift
is playing small.

Thinking you are equal to a cockroach or a grain of sand in my mind is playing small. Using your amazing God given gifts to recognize and utilize your abilities is not what I would call egoism, but common sense. Don't you see that we have gifts that enable us to "lord" over creation for its benefit, or for its harm. By you pretending that humans are equal to everything else causes harm to yourself, others, and the world. It allows you to abdicate your responsibility with your unique, special, and amazing gifts as a human being. Yeah call me anthropocentric, I don't care, "I'm a fan of man!" (except not in the false way Pacino presents it).

Quote: FrGamble

Thinking you are equal to a cockroach or a grain of sand in my mind is playing small.

Sand? Where did I ever say sand was equal
to anything but other sand. Get real.

Quote:

By you pretending that humans are equal to everything else

Oh, I'm not pretending. The Indians believed,
and rightfully so, they were equal to the buffalo,
and thanked him when they took a life. They
realized the buffalo was just as important as
they were. Why can't you see that obvious
truth.

The pope said last night:

'The presence of the Lord in the midst of his people cancels the sorrow of defeat and the misery of slavery, and ushers in joy and happiness.'

Slavery? The Bible never speaks against
slavery, even Jesus never said anything
about it. It was an accepted practice, why
would he.

Oh I feel sorry for the dead horse you keep beating. We've all discussed this and just to recap: slavery in the ancient world was not the same as the slavery of individuals based on their race or that they were somehow inferior that we are all unfortunately familiar with. Also Jesus tells us to treat our neighbor as ourselves, Paul writes an entire letter against slavery, and the in the OT one of the central stories is of God hearing the cry of a people who were slaves. Also slavery is still alive today in its most grotesque and hidden forms - we all need to take seriously the Pope's words and speak out against slavery and human trafficking.

The prophet Isaiah from the midnight Mass readings on Christmas:
"For the yoke that burdened them,
the pole on their shoulder,
and the rod of their taskmaster
you have smashed,"

Quote: FrGamble

Oh I feel sorry for the dead horse you keep beating. We've all discussed this and just to recap: slavery in the ancient world was not the same as the slavery of individuals based on their race

It doesn't matter what the cause is, it's
a major violation of human rights. The
Bible doesn't seem concerned about
this at all, nor about the rights of women.
The Bible says women are inferior to men.
To this day, women are not allowed to
be priests. Women were looked at as
possessions, they ran nothing and made
no decisions. You could sell your daughter
if you liked.

Obviously women are as smart as men, I'd
say smarter in many ways. They obviously
deserve the same rights as men have. Yet
god, who knows everything, has overlooked
half of humanity. Following a god that screwed
up that badly would seem odd to me.

Bob do you tire of being wrong? As I've mentioned and shown many times the Bible is greatly concerned about slavery. From the chosen people whom God frees from slavery through Christ who commands that we love others as He has loved us. You also couldn't be more wrong about the treatment of women. Jesus had many women disciples who followed him, they were the first witnesses of the Resurrection, Mary is held out as the greatest example of what it means to be a Christian. Paul speaks about there being no slave or freed person, Jew or Gentile, male or female in the Christ - we are all equal in God's eyes. Yes we have different roles, but this has nothing at all to do with who is smarter or better.

Now if you want to talk about women looked at as possessions please direct your ire where it should be, namely the scourge of pornography. This widespread phenomenon has caused more harm to women than could ever be imagined from the past patriarchal society.

Quote: FrGamble

You also couldn't be more wrong about the treatment of women. .

Big subject, most disagree with you. I
certainly do.

"The bible teaches that women brought sin and death into the world, that she precipitated the fall of the race, that she was arraigned before the judgment seat of Heaven, tried, condemned and sentenced. Marriage for her was to be a condition of bondage, maternity a period suffering and anguish, and in silence and subjection, she was to play the role of a dependent on man's bounty for all her material wants, and for all the information she might desire... Here is the Bible position of woman briefly summed up."
--Elizabeth Cady Stanton

The Dark Bible and Woman's Inferior Status http://www.nobeliefs.com/DarkBible/darkbible7.htm#women-shall-not-speak

Your own church still won't let women be priests,
or even marry women.

Again Bob your sources are beyond the pale atrocious and it is no wonder your ideas are twisted by them. Please open your mind to include some better resources to give you better balance. No Scripture scholar I have ever read and nothing in all my years of seminary study and continuing formation would agree in the slightest with your quote, ironically from a racist.

In regards to the questions you have about the priesthood I think you will find some good answers here The Priesthood