"Cult of Mary"

Quote: FrGamble

What caused the big bang? For that we need to either continue the backwards.. Do we then have an impersonal force, a cosmic RNG, a blob of no significance.. seems to give evidence to the contrary... This fine tuning is done .. Looking at all of this together could lead one into believing in a personal God..

Whew, what a lot of speculation! My head is
spinning. If this that are true, then that and
this must be true. No proof at all, of course.
Much easier to believe all of this has been
here forever in one form or another, including us.

Quote:

it is because they are breaking God's law and are sinning.

No, they are reaping what they're sowing. If
you plant distrust with lies and deception, that's
what you get back. Sin has nothing to do with
it, cause and effect is the culprit. If you want
to live a life of lies and deception, there's nothing
stopping you. Just don't expect to be very happy
or have peace of mind. Payback is now, not after
you die. Just because you think someone is 'getting
away' with something and needs punishment later,
don't be fooled. That person is suffering plenty
now, and probably isn't even aware of it. He thinks
it's normal to feel unhappy, paranoid, hateful, and
always dissatisfied. He has money and that solves
everything.

Quote: Evenbob

Much easier to believe all of this has been
here forever in one form or another, including us.

My mind is spinning that you refuse to recognize modern cosmology, the laws of the physical universe, and the uniqueness of human beings as evidence. What do you have for evidence or proof that the universe is eternal?

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No, they are reaping what they're sowing. If
you plant distrust with lies and deception, that's
what you get back. ... Payback is now, not after
you die.

I don't know it sounds an awful like an Parker Bros. board game to me. Who made up these rules?

Quote: FrGamble

What do you have for evidence or proof that the universe is eternal?

Me and you.

Quote: Frg

Who made up these rules?

They aren't rules, they are what happens.
You can't dispute any of it. You blame
sin, and I just accept it for what it is.

Quote: Evenbob

Me and you.

I don't know about you but I was created and am not eternal.

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They aren't rules, they are what happens.
You can't dispute any of it. You blame
sin, and I just accept it for what it is.

Okay they aren't rules it just is that whenever this happens then this other thing will happen. Sounds kind of like a rule to me. You blame it on people lying or being deceitful, or greedy, etc. - all of which I call sin, so we are on the same page.

Quote: FrGamble

I don't know about you but I was created and am not eternal.

I give you permission to believe that,
it doesn't change the truth a whit.

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Okay they aren't rules it just is that whenever this happens then this other thing will happen. Sounds kind of like a rule to me. .

It's a guideline, some people are true sociopaths
and aren't effected by anything. It's just common
sense, like most things in life. Common sense
doesn't point to sin, that's why most of the world
knew nothing about it till it was explained to them.

Quote: Evenbob

I give you permission to believe that,
it doesn't change the truth a whit.

More than giving me permission, give me proof.

Quote:

It's just common
sense, like most things in life. Common sense
doesn't point to sin, that's why most of the world
knew nothing about it till it was explained to them.

I like how you like to squiggle out of things using different words, that are pretty much the same thing. Guidelines, rules, and now common sense. There is nothing more common sensical than the the fact we all make mistakes and feel bad about them. Throughout human history you have never needed to explain to anyone this reality of human existence, sin is part and parcel of our being. The proof is in the guideline or "common sense" you have explained. Sin or evil leads to unhappiness.

Quote: FrGamble

More than giving me permission, give me proof.

You're all the proof you need.

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Sin or evil leads to unhappiness.

Sin only exists for religious people who
believe in it. It can't exist outside of
that, like any concept can't. Same with
Karma. Like sin, Karma is another religious
ruse to get people to behave themselves.

Quote: Evenbob

You're all the proof you need.

Please explain.

Quote:

Sin only exists for religious people who
believe in it...Like sin, Karma is another religious
ruse to get people to behave themselves.

Okay so religious people are the only ones who feel regret for their mistakes? What about what you were explaining to us all just a few posts ago about the bad get what comes around to them; sounds a lot like karma. What do you call it in your make believe world of changing definitions and refusal to see the truth?

Quote: FrGamble

Okay so religious people are the only ones who feel regret for their mistakes?

They're the ones who take advantage of it
by saying it's against god and call it sin.
Normal people learn from their mistakes
and move on. They don't fret and worry
they just hurt gods feeling and will be
punished for it. Even Santa is a frightening
Christian concoction.

He knows when you are sleeping, he knows
when you're awake, he knows if you've been
bad or good. He keeps a list of your transgressions
and decides if you deserve a reward. Sound
like anybody we know?

Goodness are you talking about Jesus Christ who died for you and loves you unconditionally despite all your mistakes. It sounds like you think Christians worship the boogeyman or Santa. Again, all of this makes it so clear to me that some people don't understand Christianity and what they reject has very little semblance to what I believe.

Normal people actually have quite a hard time moving on from their mistakes they need forgiveness, we all do. You admitted this when we were talking about confession not too long ago. God frees people from their sins and allows them to truly learn from their mistakes and stop allowing the past to haunt them. Religion truly helps them to move on. The non-believers sadly often have a hard time forgiving themselves and wallow in their mistakes, it is sad and so unnecessary.