the death of coal?

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January 19th, 2022 at 10:19:06 AM permalink
Mission146
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 18
Posts: 3133
The choice makes sense to me. I'm obviously not an expert on nuclear reactors, but certainly some of the people who may lose their jobs in the mines will be able to have some sort of position working for whatever company owns the nuclear reactor. I imagine there are many different readings that must be monitored and analyzed by a human being as a failsafe, which is also the case in coal mines, so perhaps there is more workplace skill transferability (in some positions) than one might initially expect.

Of course, I'm talking out of my @$$ right now, so maybe not. Either way, displaced coal mine workers could almost certainly qualify to at least be custodians or security guards in the nuclear power plant. Everyone needs custodians and security guards.
"War is the remedy that our enemies have chosen..let us give them all they want." William T. Sherman
January 19th, 2022 at 10:41:52 AM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 158
Posts: 15140
If Homer Simpson can do it...
Pro-lifer eats meatball with entire human inside without noticing. "Yum Yum", he says.
January 19th, 2022 at 12:14:06 PM permalink
missedhervee
Member since: Apr 23, 2021
Threads: 61
Posts: 2375
I just can't see nuclear power becoming viable again until / unless we finally designate and build a long term depository for all of our nuclear waste, both past and present.

Hello, Yucca mountain.

With Harry Reid now dead it may be time to once again push for its selection; this stuff needs to go somewhere, and if not the middle of nowhere, then where?
January 19th, 2022 at 12:28:08 PM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 16971
Quote: missedhervee
I just can't see nuclear power becoming viable again until / unless we finally designate and build a long term depository for all of our nuclear waste, both past and present.

Hello, Yucca mountain.

With Harry Reid now dead it may be time to once again push for its selection; this stuff needs to go somewhere, and if not the middle of nowhere, then where?


Blast it towards the Sun.
The President is a fink.
January 19th, 2022 at 1:01:59 PM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1049
Posts: 12414
Campbell county WY in the heart of coal country has 17,574 household with 2.66 persons per household and in 2018 employeed 4,586 people to mine 283,262,560 tons of coal.

There are 8 Power Plants in Campbell County, Wyoming, 6 in Gillette and 2 in Wright. There are 108 coal fired electric plants in Wyoming.

Wyoming generates 6 Megawatt hours of electricity per person per month, which is not only the largest amount in the nation, but is 14 times the 0.425 Megatt hours of electricity per person per month generated in California. Residential rate for electricity is 11.69 cents per kWh in October 2021 compared to 14.11 national average and 22.00 cents in California. Presumably Wyoming sells most of its electricity to Denver which is 300 miles away from Gillette. Gillette proclaims itself the "Energy Capital of the Nation".

Presumably with the capacity to generate so much electricity, electric vehicles would be popular in Wyoming, but in 2018 153,442 BEVs were sold in California and 92 in Wyoming.

Coal generates over 40% of the world's electricity and over 70% of the world's steel production. So Wyoming would love to be able to move coal to the Pacific by railroad and ship it over the Pacific on barges, but Washington and Oregon won't let them build a facility to load the coal onto barges. They can easily ship coal by rail to Louisiana, but the Panama Canal is far too expensive to pass coal barges through.

Eliminating coal as a generation source is made somewhat easier because the Total electricity generated per year has been virtually flatline for the last 20 years. It is just a matter of replacing the coal generators with natural gas and renewable.

If we should need more electricity (for vehicles for instance) that may change. Also it is becoming popular to require that new homes be all electric instead of using natural gas for heat.

Total Elec/yr decade Coal Generated Elec/yr
8.5% from 1950 to 1960 10.0%
7.3% from 1960 to 1970 5.7%
4.1% from 1970 to 1980 5.1%
2.9% from 1980 to 1990 3.2%
2.3% from 1990 to 2000 2.1%
0.8% from 2000 to 2010 -0.6%
-0.3% from 2010 to 2020 -8.3%
June 1st, 2022 at 12:14:53 AM permalink
petroglyph
Member since: Aug 3, 2014
Threads: 25
Posts: 6162
https://www.zerohedge.com/energy/another-nuclear-plant-closes-get-ready-electricity-shortages

'More evidence of that came with the recent closure of the Palisades Power Plant in Michigan. The 811-megawatt nuclear plant was shut down on the same day that the North American Electric Reliability Corporation (NERC) issued a report saying the U.S. electric grid doesnít have enough generation capacity and that blackouts are almost certain to occur across the country this summer."

"Palisades was a zero-carbon workhorse. As Tim Cavanaugh of the Mackinac Center for Public Policy explained recently, Palisades was producing about 7 terawatt-hours of juice per year. Thatís more energy than is generated by all the wind turbines in Michigan."
The last official act of any government is to loot the treasury. GW
June 1st, 2022 at 3:31:29 AM permalink
Pacomartin
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 1049
Posts: 12414
Quote: petroglyph
'More evidence of that came with the recent closure of the Palisades Power Plant in Michigan. The 811-megawatt nuclear plant was shut down on the same day that the North American Electric Reliability Corporation (NERC) issued a report saying the U.S. electric grid doesnít have enough generation capacity and that blackouts are almost certain to occur across the country this summer."

"Palisades was a zero-carbon workhorse. As Tim Cavanaugh of the Mackinac Center for Public Policy explained recently, Palisades was producing about 7 terawatt-hours of juice per year. Thatís more energy than is generated by all the wind turbines in Michigan."


Palisade's original 40 year licensee was due to expire on March 24, 2011. An application for 20-year extension was filed in 2005 with the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. It was granted on January 18, 2007. Therefore, the plant was then scheduled for decommissioning by 2031.

On April 20, 2022, just weeks before the facility was scheduled to close, Michigan governor Gretchen Whitmer requested federal funding to keep the facility open.

List of nuclear power plants closed in the last decade
811 Mwe May 2022 Palisades Plant. Michigan
1,038 Mwe Apr, 2021 Indian Point 3 New York
601 Mwe Aug, 2020 Duane Arnold Iowa
1,020 Mwe Apr, 2020 Indian Point 2 New York
803 Mwe Sep, 2019 Three Mile Island 1 Pennsylvania
685 Mwe May, 2019 Pilgrim Massachusetts
614 Mwe Sep, 2018 Oyster Creek New Jersey
479 Mwe Oct, 2016 Fort Calhoun Nebraska
620 Mwe Dec, 2014 Vermont Yankee Vermont
1,070 Mwe Jun, 2013 San Onofre 2 California
1,080 Mwe Jun, 2013 San Onofre 3 California
566 Mwe May, 2013 Kewaunee Wisconsin
860 Mwe Feb, 2013 Crystal River 3 Florida

It's important to understand that none of these plants was denied their 20 year extension by the Nuclear Regulatoy Commission. No nuclear plants projects were essentially started after Three Mile Island Incident on March 28, 1979, but some were in process and approved after that date. All initial licenses were for 40 years with a process to get recertified after that in 20 year intervals. All plants that applied were recertified (so far) but many were shut down after getting their recertification. The Nuclear Regulatoy Commission did not shut down any plants. They were all shut down by their operator for one reason or another.

Indian Point was essentially shut down because it was a 45 mile drive from there to Times Square. Although that was obviously true when the plant was first issued an operating license on March 26, 1962, it was then considered valuable to have a plant so close to Manhattan. The political climate has changed radically since 1962.

In 1962 the amount of electricity generated in the nation had doubled since 1953.
In 2020 the amount of electricity generated in the nation had doubled since 1975.

While no one expects the percentage increases in demands of the 1950s to return, the need to power fleets of electric cars and the desire replace existing coal, nuclear, and natural gas plants as well as natural gas home heating and home cooking may create a whole new era of demand.
June 1st, 2022 at 9:38:09 AM permalink
petroglyph
Member since: Aug 3, 2014
Threads: 25
Posts: 6162
I searching for a home generator. Not one big enough to run our main ac. 10.8kw, but one that will run a small window unit to keep at least one room bearable at 115 degrees outside temp. And maybe stop my freezer from melting. An extended power outage in this area will be seriously dangerous for old folks and those with compromised health.
The last official act of any government is to loot the treasury. GW
June 1st, 2022 at 9:49:25 AM permalink
rxwine
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 158
Posts: 15140
Quote: petroglyph
I searching for a home generator. Not one big enough to run our main ac. 10.8kw, but one that will run a small window unit to keep at least one room bearable at 115 degrees outside temp. And maybe stop my freezer from melting. An extended power outage in this area will be seriously dangerous for old folks and those with compromised health.


Can you close the doors of some rooms you don't use very often, and close the vents in them. Would that help?
Pro-lifer eats meatball with entire human inside without noticing. "Yum Yum", he says.
June 1st, 2022 at 10:02:44 AM permalink
AZDuffman
Member since: Oct 24, 2012
Threads: 135
Posts: 16971
Quote: rxwine
Can you close the doors of some rooms you don't use very often, and close the vents in them. Would that help?


How would it help if the power was off?
The President is a fink.
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