Hey FrGamble!

Quote: Evenbob

And there you have it. Perfect
faith in a good outcome is
the same as perfect fore
knowledge. So you just admitted
no sacrifice is possible when
you know for sure the deck is
100% stacked in your favor.
Thanks for finally seeing the light..

This guy says it very well:

"The total of Jesus’s only claim to sacrifice is pain and anguish. Now, I’m not saying being crucified is a walk in the park. But really? For the God of the universe, a finite amount of human pain followed by being raised into glory in the sure knowledge that the battle for the universe is won? That hardly qualifies as an epic sacrifice, surely. The idea is that God sent himself to kill himself to atone to himself for the sinful nature he’d created in human beings."

When you look at it that way
the whole thing is pretty
silly and convoluted, to say the
least. The sacrifice of Jesus is
supposed to be the greatest
sacrifice ever made, yet you
can't even find it unless you
twist and turn logic and reason
inside out. A whole religion
is based on it. Shows the gullibility
of humans, they'll believe anything
if the sellers are convincing enough.

Quote: FrGamble

There are no secrets in the Trinity, they are one God because in their community of love they give to each other fully. Think of the ideal love of husband and wife that the two become one flesh.
Jesus knew He was God but in His full humanity was not omniscient. The Incarnation meant He was not outside of time. He had a human intellect and was therefore limited in His knowledge and understanding. He had perfect faith and trust in God His Father as we are called to have, but did not know in the sense you mean it in your question of what would happen after His Resurrection. He had the faith of Abraham if that helps to explain it. Another thing that might help is to listen to the song from Jesus Christ Superstar when Jesus is in the Garden of Gethseme. I think it does a fairly good dramatic portal of what Jesus knew and didn't know. Hope that helps.

Why did Jesus need perfect faith in God if he is part and parcel of God?¹

If his faith was so perfect why did he shout at God: "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" ("My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?")²












1 - Of course, the response will be some form of "His human side needed it'
2 - Waiting for a response that this "quote" was mistranslated and/or taken "out of context"

Quote: aceofspades

Why did Jesus need perfect faith in God if he is part and parcel of God?¹

I think you seem to have a decent understanding of this answer. Remember God is saving humanity. Humanity is saved by having faith and trust in God.

Quote:

If his faith was so perfect why did he shout at God: "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" ("My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?")²

A beautiful question. It shows the depth of Christ's spiritual and physical anguish on the cross. God feels the reality of pain, suffering, death, and abandonment. We can never understand the awesome nature of this mystery and the lengths that God's love will go for us. This is a quote from one of the psalms that every Jewish person would know. It is about the faithfulness of the just man who trusts in God even when he suffers unjustly at the hands of his evil enemies. You should read the full psalm it explains a lot.











1 - Of course, the response will be some form of "His human side needed it'
2 - Waiting for a response that this "quote" was mistranslated and/or taken "out of context"

Quote: aceofspades

f his faith was so perfect why did he shout at God: "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" ("My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?")²

According to Ehrman and other
scholars, he probably never said
it. In some of the early translations
it says 'why do you mock me'. Some
scribe didn't like that so he changed
it to 'forsaken me' because it matched
the Psalm verse. And it got copied as
forsaken more often than not.

Jesus probably said none of the
things on the cross he supposedly
said. In some gospels he says
almost nothing, in others you can't
shut him up, he's a regular Chatty
Cathy. Very easy for early scribes
to add whatever they like to advance
the new religions narrative.

I assume the Vatican will soon be readying a space program to send missions to whichever planet these aircraft turn out to be from

https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/research/a33413777/pentagon-ufo-program-materials-vehicles/?utm_medium=social-media&utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=socialflowTWPOP&src=socialflowTW

I would be a volunteer for the firat Vatican space exploration mission.

https://www.newsweek.com/mother-teresas-charity-being-investigated-child-trafficking-1027780

whyisv frgamble less active these days? More leisure , more worries.

more worries

Quote: FrGamble

more worries

I find that hard to believe when
you have such a powerful
supernatural force 100% on
your side waiting to do your bidding
at a moments notice. According
to what Jesus says in the NT.
What could you possibly have
to worry about.