Catholic Church Collapsing

Quote: FrGamble

One you have already made up your mind about.

Empirical evidence will do that too
you.

So will prejudice.

Quote: Evenbob

What's meaningful to me is, it depicts a man
6' tall. The average Jew in Jesus time
was 5'1".

I think it is interesting that you are worrying about the height of Jesus in the cloth while ignoring the fact that it is a photographic negative that even if you believe the fire tainted 14th century radio-carbon dating is quite impossible to explain. Why would an anonymous artist develop photography, never share the discovery, and create a work that couldn't really even been seen until hundreds of years later? If I were you I would find that more meaningful than a man a few inches taller than average.

Quote: FrGamble

not to mention the scientific evidence that shows an expanding universe, etc.

Yet, curiously, this seems to only convince believers
that god exists, and nobody else.

That is curious isn't it?

Quote: FrGamble

I think it is interesting that you are worrying about the height of Jesus in the cloth while ignoring the fact that it is a photographic negative .

There is so much evidence pointing to the
fact this is an artifact created in the 14th
century that I'm not even going to argue
about it, too ridiculous. I like the 6' thing
because it's one of the more glaring
reasons it's a fake. If Jesus towered over
his own people and the Romans by a
foot, he would have been in the town
square on display. Jews ate mostly bread
and fish, not enough protein to make
them grow very tall. The Japanese were
the same until after WWII. They also
ate mostly fish and were 5' tall on average.
They are much bigger now thanks to
the addition of red meat in the 50's.

Even today the average Israeli Jew is
only 5'9".

Quote: FrGamble

That is curious isn't it?

Hardly. The true believers will glom onto
any straw of hope that there is a creation
and it was done by god. Oh look, an
expanding universe is mentioned in
the Bible, kind of. The Bible might not
be all fairy tales and awful bad history after
all! Whew..

Um... a straw of hope that there is a creation?!? Where did the stuff around you come from? You don't even need the scientific evidence to see that something does not come from nothing. Just your common experience of things and life as well as the impossibility of an infinite regress. Overall, though I am glad you understand the significance of an expanding universe. Maybe now you can try to find something to support your idea that there is definitely no God, good luck.

Quote: FrGamble

Um... a straw of hope that there is a creation?!?

That's what it seems like. Christians will
use anything, circular logic, circular
reasoning, cherry pick what tidbits real
science throws their way, to prop up
the idea Jehovah created all this and
sits in heaven worrying about them
endlessly. That he has a 'plan' for their
lives, when that's impossible. That
they are being judged on their
every thought and action. That god
is the original 'thought police', and
you are sooooo important in his
important scheme of things, that one
thought out of line, and it's off with
your head.

Narcissism unleashed in all it's glory,
the whole existence of the world is
about meeeeeee......

Sorry, it's not.

Quote: buzzardknot

what about the Shroud of Dublin ? ? ?

Come now. Do you really think people would be stupid enough to make up a fake relic to worship a fake god?

Oh, wait...